War in Ukraine

#40,851
#40,851
apevol said:
tactical nukes
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Got it. Russia won't drop TNs on Ukraine. It would start a world war and even if that doesn't happen, fall-out could easily leak across the border into Russia.

Russia wants to add Ukraine back into their fold by either putting in Puppet Government or just by direct conquest. I think Putin thought it would be an easy walk-in take over and that hasn't turned out at all. Now it is a real war and Russia is mostly fighting now to save face.
 
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#40,852
#40,852
LSU-SIU said:
I thought the terms were pretty simple, get rid of the weapons and stop the NATO ********. LOL
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And let Russia take more territory, dictate their foreign policy, take steps towards voluntary annexation like Belarus, etc.

Thank god the Baltics got out of Russia’s sphere of influence forever.
 
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#40,854
#40,854
LSU-SIU said:
If there are NATO troops and nukes in the Ukraine, when they came over the border... Russia has to nuke Russia. LOL Its just buffer, that's where the nuclear war would take place.

I noticed your comments about propaganda, ultimately I don't think propaganda really changes things much at the end of the day. They will continue to fight and turn the whole country into a parking lot. Ukraine lost.

Now its onto Germany (Europe), different war, no trench warfare required.
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Except there was no major plan for Ukraine to be a part of NATO. As you stated earlier they first asked back in 2002. What suddenly changed where Ukraine was going to join NATO?
 
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#40,855
#40,855
DonjoVol said:
No. I want Russia and Ukraine to find a peaceful solution. I've said that before.

I also have enough common sense to know that the U.S. should have never gotten involved in the foreign affairs of Ukraine and that way too much money aid is being wasted there.

Curious. Do you honestly believe everything you share in this thread from the supposed "mainstream" outlets.
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Fair enough.

Define mainstream outlets. I mean it's not like Fox or CBS has reporters on the ground in Ukraine, eh.
 
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#40,857
#40,857
volbound1700 said:
Got it. Russia won't drop TNs on Ukraine. It would start a world war and even if that doesn't happen, fall-out could easily leak across the border into Russia.

Russia wants to add Ukraine back into their fold by either putting in Puppet Government or just by direct conquest. I think Putin thought it would be an easy walk-in take over and that hasn't turned out at all. Now it is a real war and Russia is mostly fighting now to save face.
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Yeah, and Russia won't invade the Ukraine. LOL

If NATO was coming across the Ukraine, I'm sure they would use TNs.

It would start a world war
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They would already be at war. LOL
 
#40,858
#40,858
volbound1700 said:
Got it. Russia won't drop TNs on Ukraine. It would start a world war and even if that doesn't happen, fall-out could easily leak across the border into Russia.

Russia wants to add Ukraine back into their fold by either putting in Puppet Government or just by direct conquest. I think Putin thought it would be an easy walk-in take over and that hasn't turned out at all. Now it is a real war and Russia is mostly fighting now to save face.
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Russia absolutely wants Ukraine for exactly what he's talking about (in addition to other things). Its a long tough slog trying to move through those plains trying to get to Russia. Russia gives itself reasons to validate its own paranoia. Has happened over and over and over again.
 
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#40,861
#40,861
apevol said:
Russia absolutely wants Ukraine for exactly what he's talking about (in addition to other things). Its a long tough slog trying to move through those plains trying to get to Russia. Russia gives itself reasons to validate its own paranoia. Has happened over and over and over again.
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Well Ukraine was also the bread basket of Russia back in the day (best farmland), has ample metal supplies, has 30 million people and major Black Sea ports such as Odessa, Cherson, etc. It is also a leading region for heavy industry. It was the richest USSR province outside of Russia itself. It is obvious why they want it back. It would be like the USA losing California and then trying to get it back.
 
#40,862
#40,862
LSU-SIU said:
Who reads anything from Russia, the politicians are telling you what they are going to do. The fog of war is a thing. Who cares? At the end of the day, Ukraine lost, not much can be done about that. Another 6-12 months and it will look like a Walmart parking lot.

But Ukraine just blew up some old tanks, send us money! :p None of that is going to change that Ukraine is going to just an empty spot on a map.
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So again, in order to avoid nuking Ukraine, they just went in and glassed the place with non nuclear weapons? That's supposed to be some win or big strategic gain for Russia.

US nukes in Ukraine would not have stopped Russian nukes in Russia. US nukes in Ukraine doesnt stop it from being the buffer state. All russia did was move up the time table in which Ukrainians died. Hardly a win for Russia.
 
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#40,864
#40,864
volbound1700 said:
Well Ukraine was also the bread basket of Russia back in the day (best farmland), has ample metal supplies, has 30 million people and major Black Sea ports such as Odessa, Cherson, etc. It is also a leading region for heavy industry. It was the richest USSR province outside of Russia itself. It is obvious why they want it back. It would be like the USA losing California and then trying to get it back.
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Ukraine was on the verge of becoming a hub for western energy companies, speculators, etc. Putin attacked because they were going to be wealthy enough to have a say in their own destiny.
 
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#40,865
#40,865
apevol said:
Ukraine was on the verge of becoming a hub for western energy companies, speculators, etc. Putin attacked because they were going to be wealthy enough to have a say in their own destiny.
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Yep. Ukraine was positioned to take a higher position on the world stage than Russia and Pootin couldn’t stand it.
 
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#40,866
#40,866
volbound1700 said:
That is an excuse, they just want Ukraine back into their country. NATO could have made a move against them under Yeltsin or early Putin era when they were very vulnerable militarily.
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Agreed. The timeline doesnt line up with the actions of Russia if their stated goals are real.

Ukraine only became a real threat to join NATO after they were invaded by Russia.
 
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#40,867
#40,867
LSU-SIU said:
Obviously Ukraine was trying to join NATO, not sure where you are getting that from. How could Russia wait longer, you are saying they are having a hard time? You are justifying why they invaded.



I said they either bend the knee or get destroyed. They could have bent the knee and Russia would have been happy with that, I would imagine.
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Yeah sure Ukraine was trying to join. Had been 2002. Why did they wait until 2022?

Russias coup backfired and made them invade since their long con had failed.
 
#40,868
#40,868
LSU-SIU said:
If NATO is in the Ukraine with nukes, than Russia couldn't use the area for TNs. It really is that simple. LOL
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And if Ukraine was actually neutral Russia also couldnt have used Ukraine for their tactical nukes.

The only way Russia gets nukes in Ukraine is if Ukraine was under their thumb, and not neutral.

What's the long game here for Russia occupy Ukraine for eternity? They arent going to forget that Russia invaded them for this.
 
#40,870
#40,870
Hunerwadel said:
I believe he called himself an intellectual. He shouldn't have had to tell anyone though. His clever injection of dog $h!t into the conversation made it apparent.
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Oh this guy clearly “thinks” on a completely different plane than the rest of us. Even the other three stooges are in awe of this cat 😂
 
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#40,871
#40,871
LouderVol said:
And if Ukraine was actually neutral Russia also couldnt have used Ukraine for their tactical nukes.

The only way Russia gets nukes in Ukraine is if Ukraine was under their thumb, and not neutral.

What's the long game here for Russia occupy Ukraine for eternity? They arent going to forget that Russia invaded them for this.
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Ukraine would be the landing spots for the tactical nukes if the Nazi came over, the nukes would not be stationed in the Ukraine.

Ukraine was/is the nuclear war zone, hence the agreements.
 
#40,872
#40,872
apevol said:
Ukraine was on the verge of becoming a hub for western energy companies, speculators, etc. Putin attacked because they were going to be wealthy enough to have a say in their own destiny.
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They were already going along with their plan to have a say in their own destiny, the problem is they signed some of those away in the 90s. Hence, the invasion. I'm sure Putin would agree with you.
 
#40,874
#40,874
MontyPython said:
Seems our Armchair economists here predicting some sort of absurd European economic collapse don't know diddly.

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We're going to have to see how the winter and the following years work out. I would say the prices they are paying is not sustainable for economic growth. Nothing is a given, only a possibility.

You kind of act like a person that needs a tampon, none of this is going to be solved anytime soon.

Maybe put the mouse/keyboard down for awhile, I assure you the chances of this all getting solved today is pretty close to ZERO.

Ukraine will continue to be turned into a parking lot, commodities prices especially those paid by Germany will probably continue to be high... wait and see how it impacts their economy in the months or years ahead.

Its all about costs.
 
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#40,875
#40,875
LSU-SIU said:
Ukraine would be the landing spots for the tactical nukes if the Nazi came over, the nukes would not be stationed in the Ukraine.

Ukraine was/is the nuclear war zone, hence the agreements.
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And they still would be if they were part of NATO.

The only way Ukraine being part of NATO makes a difference in a nuclear war is if NATO launches an all out nuke offensive first that takes out all of Russia/Russian nukes. As long as the Russians are able to get off any nukes they could still hit Ukraine.

The only reason Russia would need to use nukes would be in case either the west used them first, in which case Ukraine doesnt matter; or they are losing/being pushed backed. Which we have been assured multiple times is impossible because Russia is clearly toying with NATO in Ukraine, and the west is a spent force about to collapse.
 
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