War in Ukraine

#47,728
#47,728
Velo Vol said:
The Putinists here like to crow about how badly Europe needs Russian energy. They're mysteriously silent, though, on the fact that Russia needs to sell gas to Europe to keep its energy industry/economy afloat. Both sides rely on the other.
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What Bidenists are overlooking is that the factories that are closing in Germany, the UK, and elsewhere in Europe produced goods that will still be produced, just not by Europeans. As factories in China produce the goods no longer produced in Europe, it'll need to import more energy to run those factories. Just look at how much energy China imports today versus decades ago before the USA shut down most of its factories and China began making everything Americans use. Do you think China is going to buy cheap Russian gas to produce the goods no longer made in Europe, or will China rely on the USA ship over boatloads of expensive liquified natural gas?
 
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#47,731
#47,731
AM64 said:
You forget the US military is under civilian control. Civilian control decides if/when the military acts, places limits, sets agenda, determines rules of engagement that often negate the effectiveness of our weapons systems ... often absurdly expensive weapons systems that they approved - sometimes even over the objection of the military. Civilian control is necessary as an extension of foreign policy and domestic safety; micromanagement by civilian authority rather than those on scene is just bad management.

As a vet and generally from a military family, your analysis is both wrong and frankly repulsive.
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We've lost wars to countries whose militaries were also under the control of civilians. Your excuse is like a football fan saying his team lost because it had to play in the rain when the other team also played in the rain. If the US military can't win its wars because it doesn't have carte blanche to do whatever it wants, then the generals should say so before their wars start instead of boasting about a victory that never actually ends up happening and them making excuses afterwards. That's pathetic, but that's the US military for you.
 
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#47,732
#47,732
JuicyBrucey said:
What Bidenists are overlooking is that the factories that are closing in Germany, the UK, and elsewhere in Europe produced goods that will still be produced, just not by Europeans. As factories in China produce the goods no longer produced in Europe, it'll need to import more energy to run those factories. Just look at how much energy China imports today versus decades ago before the USA shut down most of its factories and China began making everything Americans use. Do you think China is going to buy cheap Russian gas to produce the goods no longer made in Europe, or will China rely on the USA ship over boatloads of expensive liquified natural gas?
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You might want to revise your theory to reflect how gas is actually being moved in the real world.

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#47,733
#47,733
allvol123 said:
Just wondering why he hasn’t moved to Russia yet. Quite a wonderful place it appears. Sure they love blacks in Russia. Look at their numbers.
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This is the funniest post yet. The USA has a large black population because so many black people were brought from Africa to America in chains and put into slave labor. Russia didn't do that to blacks, certainly not to the scale Americans did, and now Americans are looking down their nose at Russians for it.
 
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#47,734
#47,734
Rasputin_Vol said:
It was easily explained, and you know that. Russia will only respond with nukes if it is used against them. Let's not pretend that Russia plans to use nukes offensively...
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Neither side wants to use nukes.
Each side wants the other to fear the nukes.
Both sides are using language to imply that they could use nukes in the most extreme circumstances.
 
#47,735
#47,735
JuicyBrucey said:
This is the funniest post yet. The USA has a large black population because so many black people were brought from Africa to America in chains and put into slave labor. Russia didn't do that to blacks, certainly not to the scale Americans did, and now Americans are looking down their nose at Russians for it.
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In the previous decade the total number of immigrants from just Nigeria to the US, exceeds the entire black population in Russia. Go find something else to clown about, clown.
 
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#47,737
#47,737
allvol123 said:
In the previous decade the total number of immigrants from just Nigeria to the US, exceeds the entire black population in Russia. Go find something else to clown about, clown.
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Opal Tometi is a black immigrant from Nigeria. She's a co-founder of BLM and accuses the USA of systemic racism against blacks.
 
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#47,739
#47,739
JuicyBrucey said:
Opal Tometi is a black immigrant from Nigeria. She's a co-founder of BLM and accuses the USA of systemic racism against blacks.
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Well hell. I guess if we can find one ****** immigrant from a country we should stop allowing them to immigrate. You've posted dumb shat but this takes the cake. And also she wasn't born there. So excuse me while I hahahahahahahhaha....clown
 
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#47,741
#47,741
USF grad in TN said:
Neither side wants to use nukes.
Each side wants the other to fear the nukes.
Both sides are using language to imply that they could use nukes in the most extreme circumstances.
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Russia is talking negotiations.

The US is saying they don't want to negotiate.

Which country is more willing to engage in a nuclear war?
 
#47,742
#47,742
JuicyBrucey said:
We've lost wars to countries whose militaries were also under the control of civilians. Your excuse is like a football fan saying his team lost because it had to play in the rain when the other team also played in the rain. If the US military can't win its wars because it doesn't have carte blanche to do whatever it wants, then the generals should say so before their wars start instead of boasting about a victory that never actually ends up happening and them making excuses afterwards. That's pathetic, but that's the US military for you.
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You're on to something here I have to say....sort of. How do you beat countries that either will just hide until you leave, no matter how many of them you kill, and then go back to doing the exact same thing once you are gone? You have to be stone cold cruel. No taking their territory easily and then building schools and sh!t like that to try to make them like you. No, in the end they have to fear you, and fear you badly. It's not the military's fault though. It's the fault of those who command them. Want to get rid of the Taliban and Al Quada forever? Easy. Kill all of them you can. Then, kill everyone who has financed them, helped them, or aided them in any way no matter where they are. Kill their families. Then they will truly fear you. If a village lets them take back over then wipe that entire place off the map. All dead. That is the only way to beat 7th century minds. Stoop their level. Unfortunately, "civilized" minds in Washington don't think that way for a variety of reasons.
 
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#47,744
#47,744
volgr said:
People are getting fed up.
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There won't be a nuclear war, but I said in a post just yesterday that I believe that the west will grow wear of this. There will end up being a bloody stalemate in Ukraine with many lives lost on both sides. No real winners here.
 
#47,745
#47,745
Rasputin_Vol said:
And you say all that (which is technically true), yet you are in here supporting the very same agenda that the leaders push, so you are just as complicit.
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We just see things in a different light, and on this topic that's not going to change. I'm not going to condemn this country for not always getting things right, nor am I about to excuse Sino/Soviet attempts to manipulate the world - and I still see no real difference between past Soviets and current Russian leaders in general. Yeah, times have changed and Russians aren't subverting the world like they used to, but I still have no use for them as things stand. I'm not going to apologize for any effort that sinks Russia and/or China, and my thoughts about Ukraine are more along the line of the enemy of my enemy. One last word on Russia, China, and most other countries is that while I do consider some countries evil, that doesn't generally extend to the people ... unless you want to consider some Islamic states with religiously brainwashed zealots.

I also won't apologize for my thoughts on our defense. Sometimes that starts elsewhere around the globe, but I'll agree with you that we've fought too many of the wrong wars in the past few decades. Ukraine is a case where we are supporting a people willing to fight for their independence rather than fighting for people who won't fight for themselves, and I've got no qualms with that. We had help from some others when our forefathers fought for independence. If we were invaded, I'd hope for outside help. Whether you see the benefit or not Ukraine is a proving ground for us. A way to know find out if our weaponry is as good as advertised without exposing our own people. A better choice than finding out stuff doesn't perform and losing our own people doing so. We are learning again about working with allies. There are other benefits, but you won't agree so no point in belaboring the issue.
 
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#47,746
#47,746
JuicyBrucey said:
This is the funniest post yet. The USA has a large black population because so many black people were brought from Africa to America in chains and put into slave labor. Russia didn't do that to blacks, certainly not to the scale Americans did, and now Americans are looking down their nose at Russians for it.
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Russia never needed to import slaves from Africa; they had serfs and other sources for slaves. Less than three hundred years ago, slavery was an established practice worldwide ... and it hasn't universally gone away. One would hope that clowns like you would some day quit applying current thoughts/standards to past practices and condemning people and countries for what happened in the past.
 
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#47,747
#47,747
norrislakevol said:
You're on to something here I have to say....sort of. How do you beat countries that either will just hide until you leave, no matter how many of them you kill, and then go back to doing the exact same thing once you are gone? You have to be stone cold cruel. No taking their territory easily and then building schools and sh!t like that to try to make them like you. No, in the end they have to fear you, and fear you badly. It's not the military's fault though. It's the fault of those who command them. Want to get rid of the Taliban and Al Quada forever? Easy. Kill all of them you can. Then, kill everyone who has financed them, helped them, or aided them in any way no matter where they are. Kill their families. Then they will truly fear you. If a village lets them take back over then wipe that entire place off the map. All dead. That is the only way to beat 7th century minds. Stoop their level. Unfortunately, "civilized" minds in Washington don't think that way for a variety of reasons.
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The US has no business going around the world being cruel and killing people in Vietnam, Libya, Afghanistan, or wherever the hell unless they have attacked us. WTF did any of these countries do to America? You sound like a clown right now. Seriously...
 
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#47,748
#47,748
Rasputin_Vol said:
Russia is talking negotiations.

The US is saying they don't want to negotiate.

Which country is more willing to engage in a nuclear war?
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Russia can end the conflict. All it requires is that they go home and not lob rockets, artillery, or fly airstrikes against Ukraine. It's certainly better to have never invaded than to have invaded and lost.
 
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