War in Ukraine

#67,576
#67,576
KB5252 said:
Just got in touch with a family friend who knows some people in Ukraine helping/advising. Says some there are worried about this possibly developing into a two front confrontation, they don't trust Prigo being in Belarus, think maybe he is being tasked with raising an army there.
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Best outcome would be that some members of the Belarusian opposition put him down.
 
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#67,577
#67,577
volinbham said:
While I don't disagree, the notion of what happens down the road is somewhat immaterial to the now.

In the short term there's a chance that reducing the tensions between Wagner and Putin is a bad thing for Ukraine. If they coordinate better in the short term or Wagner is back fully on the team then a distraction from the last several months is temporarily removed.
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I dont think there is any way Russia/Putin should count on Wagner now.
 
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#67,579
#67,579
NorthDallas40 said:
Here’s one Moe. There are claims of a total of 7 aircraft. Now start your dance saying it never happened.

Wagner Chief Claims His Forces Shot Down Russian Military Helicopter
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Kadyrov and Prigozhin both said no bloodshed...
I call on all PMC(Private Military Companies) fighters to continue to be sober in their decisions. Think about the future of the country, about your families and children. Such actions can lead to disastrous results. Now everything ended peacefully, without bloodshed, but it could happen. The extreme measure would be the harsh suppression and destruction of anyone who encroaches on the integrity of the Russian Federation.
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Now the moment has come when blood can be shed, therefore, realizing all the responsibility that Russian blood will be shed on one of the sides, we turn our columns and leave in the opposite direction to the field camps according to the plan."
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#67,580
#67,580
AM64 said:
Seems like the last time Russia was involved in something like that, the deal was Russia took the Soviet nukes in agreement that the countries giving them up would have real borders and be left alone. Shame the countries involved didn't require Russia to take it's leftover trash planted in other countries during the Soviet occupation along with the nukes. Ukraine for Ukrainians, Georgia for Georgians, etc. Cue Ras for a "history" lesson.
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No need for a history lesson. I would just point out that Ukraine had possession of nuclear weapons in much the same way that Turkiye does. Russia controlled the nukes in Ukraine the same way the US has control of the nukes in Turkiye.
 
#67,581
#67,581
AM64 said:
Even this "attempt" is pretty thin - not much chance at success unless they get some real support, but you are right it sure looks far more like insurrection than a messy party at the capitol. Best that may come of this would be a rallying point if there are actually Russians who are fed up with Pootin Russia. Likely a lot of Russians just see Pootin and Russia today as another ripple in the cesspool that make life in Russia what it is - wealth for some and poverty of varying degrees for most.
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How is that much different than the US right now. I would go a step further and say that there is one set of laws for the wealthy and another for the rest of us...
 
#67,586
#67,586
Rasputin_Vol said:
How is that much different than the US right now. I would go a step further and say that there is one set of laws for the wealthy and another for the rest of us...
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We've had a true middle class for a long time - unlike Russia, and that makes a big difference. Although ours looks to be separating into and upper and lower middle class. The health of the country largely depends on how that plays out - fracturing and dissolution of the middle class would be disaster. Unfortunately the pressures on housing and other essentials may be the death of a good thing. For example, too much going to real estate investors without recognizing or caring where the profits come from and what it means to people trying to live.

If you want to go back to our earlier arguments about inflation - large investors driving residential sale and rental prices is inflationary because there is nothing gained for the home purchaser or renter - he just pays more for the same thing.
 
#67,588
#67,588
AM64 said:
Seems like the last time Russia was involved in something like that, the deal was Russia took the Soviet nukes in agreement that the countries giving them up would have real borders and be left alone. Shame the countries involved didn't require Russia to take it's leftover trash planted in other countries during the Soviet occupation along with the nukes. Ukraine for Ukrainians, Georgia for Georgians, etc. Cue Ras for a "history" lesson.
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Yet another example of what I'm talking about... Ukraine NEVER had possession of nuclear weapons.

 
#67,590
#67,590
JMHO, Russia has a lot of internal stuff that it needs to sort out. I'll accept they didn't know the extent of corruption but at this point you can't ignore it. Get your house square, own what you've done, and get back to being a contributor to this world.
 
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#67,591
#67,591
xXRockyTopXx said:
JMHO, Russia has a lot of internal stuff that it needs to sort out. I'll accept they didn't know the extent of corruption but at this point you can't ignore it. Get your house square, own what you've done, and get back to being a contributor to this world.
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So not much different than this country
 
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#67,593
#67,593
Rasputin_Vol said:
The US middle class is declining and just the opposite for Russia.
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There's not much way it could go differently for Russia following the collapse of communism - without revolution. An evolution of people doing at least somewhat better keeps them from battering down the doors to the Kremlin. The question is whether Russia can build and maintain real profitable businesses to keep people employed, busy, and relatively happy. We're certainly slipping in accomplishing that here. That looks to me like when you are at the bottom everything is up (Russia), and for us we are letting the dream slip through neglect and incompetence (realizing you actually have to work to even maintain the status quo - that you can't plunder success without killing it).
 
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