A Racist Take On Our New Coach

#276
#276
Ravenheart said:
It shouldn't even be a factor. I don't see how being reassured that race will play zero role in team building is racist. This shows that the athlete is being recruited as a player and as a person, not as a black player and a black person. That shows that the race barrier is vulnerable and can be shattered. When I hear arguments like this, it's like two giant steps backward in that regard.
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Call Terry Fair today and tell him he's taken two giant steps backward in race relations.

I don't think you get culture. You're so tunnel visioned you're blind. Some black players are more comfortable with a black coach because they share similar upbringings, with similar experiences, both positive ones and negative ones. You're soley concentrating on nothing but epidermis.
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#277
#277
If we find out that indeed the new coach is black, then he needs to be fired. WHITE POWER

Sincerely,
Clayton Bigsby
 
#279
#279
Nashville said:
I don't think it matters for Calipari, Calhoun, K, Roy Williams or Bill Self. I remember that same argument from Kentucky fans with Tubby. It didn't work out that way AT ALL.
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Another ignorant post. Hard to believe there's enough black basketball players that white coaches get to sign some also.

Cheatapari, and Calhoun are known pay-for-play recruiters. Coach K actually has an above average number of white players for a non Mormon school. Tubby doesn't recruit period.
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#280
#280
bamacheats said:
Call Terry Fair today and tell him he's taken two giant steps backward in race relations.

I don't think you get culture. You're so tunnel visioned you're blind. Some black players are more comfortable with a black coach because they share similar upbringings, with similar experiences, both positive ones and negative ones. You're soley concentrating on nothing but epidermis.
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Makes sense to me. People like people they can identify with.
 
#281
#281
bamacheats said:
Call Terry Fair today and tell him he's taken two giant steps backward in race relations.

I don't think you get culture. You're so tunnel visioned you're blind. Some black players are more comfortable with a black coach because they share similar upbringings, with similar experiences, both positive ones and negative ones. You're soley concentrating on nothing but epidermis.
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Maybe, but understand that not all black people grew up the same way or had the same experience. A black man may have grown up in the projects while another may have grown up in an opulent neighborhood. At the end of the day, if a coach sees potential in a player, regardless of race or upbringing, and they are willing to put in the time and the effort, then they will get that opportunity to play college ball. If not, they won't. It's just like every other player.
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#282
#282
Ravenheart said:
Maybe, but understand that not all black people grew up the same way or had the same experience. A black man may have grown up in the projects while another may have grown up in an opulent neighborhood. At the end of the day, if a coach sees potential in a player, regardless of race or upbringing, and they are willing to put in the time and the effort, then they will get that opportunity to play college ball. If not, they won't. It's just like every other player.
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No kidding! Where has someone posted this as an absolute? You really want to jump on board with trevol and easley, have you seen some of their posts?
Reread the OP and explain to me what's off base.
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#284
#284
bamacheats said:
No kidding! Where has someone posted this as an absolute? You really want to jump on board with trevol and easley, have you seen some of their posts?
Reread the OP and explain to me what's off base.
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Gladly.

I'm glad to have a black head coach. I think it will pay dividends in the south. With his upbringing and life experience I believe he may win some key recruiting battles.
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Here, it sounds like you are equating being black with having a troubled childhood, living in violent neighborhoods, and having a single parent in the home as opposed to having both. This is simply untrue. I know several people who are single parents and are white as well, and on the other hand, I know several black people as well who grew up in much quieter, less violent neighborhoods. I know that doesn't explain much, but it's enough to debunk your theory. There is no denying that Cuonzo's story is a compelling story, but let's face it, at the end of the day, that factor alone will pale in comparison to the real reasons recruits come to play at Tennessee.

I know race shouldn't matter, but it does.
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You are right here. This is what is crippling this society; their constant attention to race as a factor. It is very shameful that in 2011, people still judge others based on the color of their skin.

I think when in the living room of a top prospect, possibly talking to a single mother, his story and experience will be more convincing than the $10k Cheatapari is offering.
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Let's take Calipari out of the discussion for a minute.
Yes, it is a heartwarming story that a single mother may be able to sympathize with and relate to, but let me say again that Cuonzo is not trying to build a team of kids from broken homes and troubled childhoods. He's not Coach Carter. He is Cuonzo Martin, and he is trying to build a team of the best basketball players he can get. He wants to build a team just like every other team in the country, based on ability, aptitude for the game, and desire to do what it takes to be successful (as long as it is within the rules, of course).

On Calipari, let me play Devil's Advocate here. Do you really think that Coach Zo has "outwitting Calipari" on his to-do list when he recruits players? I can assure you, he doesn't give a flying you-know-what about what Calipari does (he'll get hammered by the NCAA anyway). Let Calipari do his own thing, and Cuonzo will do his. He'll need to worry about his own house because if he focuses on tearing Calipari's house down in order to build his up, then he'll be easy pickings for the other national heavyweights.

At the end of the day, I think Bruce was well liked by his players, but I don't think that they had the respect for him that they should for a head coach. Counzo will be both I think.
GBO!
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Possibly true, but we'll never truly know. Bruce was a coach who basically told players what they wanted to hear. I don't think Cuonzo will be that kind of coach.
 
#285
#285
Ravenheart said:
Gladly.



Here, it sounds like you are equating being black with having a troubled childhood, living in violent neighborhoods, and having a single parent in the home as opposed to having both. This is simply untrue. I know several people who are single parents and are white as well, and on the other hand, I know several black people as well who grew up in much quieter, less violent neighborhoods. I know that doesn't explain much, but it's enough to debunk your theory. There is no denying that Cuonzo's story is a compelling story, but let's face it, at the end of the day, that factor alone will pale in comparison to the real reasons recruits come to play at Tennessee.



You are right here. This is what is crippling this society; their constant attention to race as a factor. It is very shameful that in 2011, people still judge others based on the color of their skin.



Let's take Calipari out of the discussion for a minute.
Yes, it is a heartwarming story that a single mother may be able to sympathize with and relate to, but let me say again that Cuonzo is not trying to build a team of kids from broken homes and troubled childhoods. He's not Coach Carter. He is Cuonzo Martin, and he is trying to build a team of the best basketball players he can get. He wants to build a team just like every other team in the country, based on ability, aptitude for the game, and desire to do what it takes to be successful (as long as it is within the rules, of course).

On Calipari, let me play Devil's Advocate here. Do you really think that Coach Zo has "outwitting Calipari" on his to-do list when he recruits players? I can assure you, he doesn't give a flying you-know-what about what Calipari does (he'll get hammered by the NCAA anyway). Let Calipari do his own thing, and Cuonzo will do his. He'll need to worry about his own house because if he focuses on tearing Calipari's house down in order to build his up, then he'll be easy pickings for the other national heavyweights.



Possibly true, but we'll never truly know. Bruce was a coach who basically told players what they wanted to hear. I don't think Cuonzo will be that kind of coach.
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You're tunnel visioned man, open your eyes. Your thinking is warped. Your opinion doesn't matter when it comes to a recruit and a coach. Just because you think it shouldn't matter doesn't make it so. It is a factor, that's a fact, and its something CCM has in his favor.
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#287
#287
easleychuck said:
You do know that racism is everywhere. And if one reads this entire thread, they will see that it is alive and thriving with some members of this board.
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I see some misguided opinions in this thread but not much racisim. Racism can often be due to ignorance but people are way too quick to proclaim racisim if someone's has an ignorant opinion in regards to race.

I have yet to see anyone display hatred for another race in this thread....
 
#288
#288
bamacheats said:
You're tunnel visioned man, open your eyes. Your thinking is warped. Your opinion doesn't matter when it comes to a recruit and a coach. Just because you think it shouldn't matter doesn't make it so. It is a factor, that's a fact, and its something CCM has in his favor.
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Excuse me for stating my opinion.
I think that it is sad that we have to stoop to this level this day in age. I think that it is very, very sad that people have to judge others based on race. It is happening, but it is beyond shameful when people are so ignorant as to think that race should play a role in whether or not a basketball coach is successful coaching-wise and recruiting-wise. We should see him as the head coach of the Tennessee Volunteers, not as "the black head coach of the Tennessee Volunteers."
 
#289
#289
Ravenheart said:
Excuse me for stating my opinion.
I think that it is sad that we have to stoop to this level this day in age. I think that it is very, very sad that people have to judge others based on race. It is happening, but it is beyond shameful when people are so ignorant as to think that race should play a role in whether or not a basketball coach is successful coaching-wise and recruiting-wise. We should see him as the head coach of the Tennessee Volunteers, not as "the black head coach of the Tennessee Volunteers."
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You're still tunnel visioned. It's not about CCM's epidermis, its about culture, experience, background. You're trying to still make it bigger than it is.

Please post a statement to the black athletes and black VN posters that say it can be a factor and explain to them that they are wrong.
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#290
#290
bamacheats said:
You're still tunnel visioned. It's not about CCM's epidermis, its about culture, experience, background. You're trying to still make it bigger than it is.

Please post a statement to the black athletes and black VN posters that say it can be a factor and explain to them that they are wrong.
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No, I'm not. Remember, you were the one who said that you were happy that we had a black coach. Fine. I am, too. Where you made your mistake is where you then started to talk about his upbringing being beneficial in terms recruiting the South and talking to single mothers when recruiting athletes. To many, that may sound like you are implying that just because he is black and had a turbulent upbringing in East St. Louis, Illinois, that that will be what wins over recruits. That is a plain fallacy. It helps, but it will not be the main reason why recruits come here.
 
#291
#291
Ravenheart said:
No, I'm not. Remember, you were the one who said that you were happy that we had a black coach. Fine. I am, too. Where you made your mistake is where you then started to talk about his upbringing being beneficial in terms recruiting the South and talking to single mothers when recruiting athletes. To many, that may sound like you are implying that just because he is black and had a turbulent upbringing in East St. Louis, Illinois, that that will be what wins over recruits. That is a plain fallacy. It helps, but it will not be the main reason why recruits come here.
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Find a post in this entire thread that says its the "main" reason.

FWIW, sounds like you now agree with me with that last sentence. I knew you'd come around eventually.
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#292
#292
bamacheats said:
Find a post in this entire thread that says its the "main" reason.

FWIW, sounds like you now agree with me with that last sentence. I knew you'd come around eventually.
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You didn't have to say it. Judging by your posts in this thread (and I have read the whole thing), you seem to be pointing in that direction.

Besides, I meant that in the sense that people will see his life story as a plus, but in the end, I don't even think that even Cuonzo himself will want a recruit to play for him based on that as much as they would want to come to play for him just because he presents the best chance of getting to the NBA.

It seems that you are missing my point. It is unfair to assume that just because he is black and he grew up in a rough neighborhood that he will be the darling of black athletes and single parents everywhere.
 
#293
#293
Ravenheart said:
You didn't have to say it. Judging by your posts in this thread (and I have read the whole thing), you seem to be pointing in that direction.

Well that's due to your tunnel vision. I've never even remotely implied that its the main reason. I clearly stated multiple times that it can be "A" factor, not "THE" factor.


It seems that you are missing my point. It is unfair to assume that just because he is black and he grew up in a rough neighborhood that he will be the darling of black athletes and single parents everywhere.
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Again, show me one post from any poster in the history of this board that claims he's "the darling of black athletes and single parents everywhere."

Plus I'm still waiting on that post to explain to black athletes that have said it can be a factor that they are wrong.
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#294
#294
bamacheats said:
Again, show me one post from any poster in the history of this board that claims he's "the darling of black athletes and single parents everywhere."

Plus I'm still waiting on that post to explain to black athletes that have said it can be a factor that they are wrong.
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Perhaps I should rephrase that. To say that he will be the darling of black athletes and single parents everywhere just because he is black and grew up the way he did is erroneous and unfair to claim. You did not state that explicitly, but you did implicitly get that point across, and I can bet the house that that is how many who replied to this thread perceived it as well.

We all agree that racism exists in this world, and in this country. But here is my point: should it? Should race determine who gets a job and who doesn't? Should race determine where a college student goes to school? Should race determine who marries who? Should race determine who we interact with? It seems foolish to think that it should. It's the same thing with Coach Zo and his recruiting methods. Yes, we have a black coach. But I do not believe that Zo came here with the intent of correlating his race and upbringing and using it to just reel in recruits like there was no tomorrow. He wanted to sell who he is, his philosophy, the program, and the school, as well as their collective goals for each year that they are at UT. That is my point.
 
#295
#295
It is apparent to me that after reading Ravenheart's logically stated and intelligently laid-out in an open-minded way in multiple posts that an opportunity to teach a life lesson has been lost.

My only hope is that the mindsets that see the world in such a fashion are not educators.
 
#296
#296
Thaddeus Young is a player from Memphis that went to Georgia Tech because his father wanted him to play for a black coach.
 
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