Arizona Pastor Arrested, Jailed for Holding Bible Study in Home

#51
#51
utvolpj said:
it's not illegal to have people (even lots of people) over to your house in AZ and it's also not illegal to park on many streets. Also good luck calling the police if cars are legally parked on the street

To my knowledge there has been no release from the PD as to why his property needed to be zoned commercial and meet those codes. They claim it's a church but on what basis?
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either way it is not about religion like the media is spinning it.
 
#53
#53
govolsfraz said:
either way it is not about religion like the media is spinning it.
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so if 20 guys get together once a week to play poker the city will classify that as a casino? It may not necessarily be about religion but it's not a rule being applied evenly. There's something fishy and it's not surprising
 
#54
#54
The guy wanted to build a church in his backyard of a small quite neighborhood. His plans got turned down so he put 140 seats in his game room and called it a bible study room. There is a lot more to this story than is being told.
 
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#55
#55
Cops and city inspectors remind him that they said he can’t have a church there. They also point out that his game room is horribly unsafe and there’s a reason commercial zoning is different than residential. See, if you plan on having over 50 people in a place on a weekly basis, you need to make sure that there’s fire sprinklers, properly marked exits, handicap access and permanent wiring as opposed to just a bunch of extension cords (just a few of the dozens of code violations).
 
#56
#56
I don't really know because I don't attend church anymore, but this sounds like more than just a Bible Study group.
 
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#57
#57
Salman gets warnings, tickets and numerous letters from the city stating he can’t have a church in his back yard. Rather than trying to reach a compromise with neighbors (all who hate him now. His next door neighbor successfully filed a restraining order against him) or complying with the city, he just keeps on Churching and ignoring everybody. Eventually the citations pile up and now he has to go to jail.
 
#58
#58
govolsfraz said:
Cops and city inspectors remind him that they said he can’t have a church there. They also point out that his game room is horribly unsafe and there’s a reason commercial zoning is different than residential. See, if you plan on having over 50 people in a place on a weekly basis, you need to make sure that there’s fire sprinklers, properly marked exits, handicap access and permanent wiring as opposed to just a bunch of extension cords (just a few of the dozens of code violations).
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so they knew what he was doing and issued the building permit anyway? Then they turned around and raided his house because of what they claim is now a church (even though he built the building around their codes)? Can you remind me who's in the wrong again? Evidently he didn't pay off the right codes official
 
#59
#59
They didn't issue any building permit. They turned his permit request down to build a church , because he was in a residential area. He did it anyway.
 
#60
#60
govolsfraz said:
They didn't issue any building permit. They turned his permit request down to build a church , because he was in a residential area. He did it anyway.
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That's because he is in a Mission from God.

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Therefore, he can do whatever he wants and anyone who dares question his means is just anti-Christian and hates religious freedom.
 
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#61
#61
govolsfraz said:
They didn't issue any building permit. They turned his permit request down to build a church , because he was in a residential area. He did it anyway.
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that goes against what is being published. He wasn't up to code for a commercial structure but the addition was built to residential codes

And this was only the beginning. In 2008, the fire department came back again, and Salman ordered officials off of his property. The town then decided to ignore him — that is until he and his family built a structure in their back hard. The family, having secured the proper building permits, then moved the Bible studies to this new building.
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Michael Salman Sentenced to 60 Days in Jail Over Home Bible Studies | Video | TheBlaze.com
 
#63
#63
Furthermore, if it's zoned as strictly residential, he may not have been allowed to use the land commercially in the first place, with or without proper adherence to codes.
 
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#64
#64
Thrasher865 said:
You cannot build something to residential codes, and then use it commercially. Do you not understand that, pj?
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actually better than most. Still waiting on proof this was anything more than a bunch of friends getting together for a bible study on private property
 
#65
#65
Well according to the guy on the previous page, he put 140 seats in this "study room." Would you agree that this would have been violating the intent of a residential property, if we find this number to be accurate?
 
#66
#66
Thrasher865 said:
Well according to the guy on the previous page, he put 140 seats in this "study room." Would you agree that this would have been violating the intent of a residential property, if we find this number to be accurate?
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uh yeah I might need a source for that
 
#67
#67
lawgator1 said:
That's because he is in a Mission from God.

images


Therefore, he can do whatever he wants and anyone who dares question his means is just anti-Christian and hates religious freedom.
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you're expressing your opinion and i'm sure somebody disagreeing with you wo'nt stop you.
 
#68
#68
Dumb. The bottom line is that is is Salman's property and the state should protect his property rights, which entails him doing whatever he pleases with his property. If others feel as though it is a hazard to have x amount of individuals in a building with no fire exits marked, then they should opt not to go to the bible-study.

Private property: it is really just property of the state that the state apparently allows individuals use, but only if they followed certain dictates from the assembly.
 
#69
#69
* Neighbors fight Salman and win. He can’t build a church in his back yard. Salman withdraws his church plans and then submits plans to the city planner to build a “game room” in his backyard. The city planner, recognizing him from five minutes ago, asks if he’s going to use this game room as a Church. Michael Salman says he will not use the room as a public church. This is a lie.



* Neighbors tip off the cops that Salman might be having church in his “game room”. Salman says it’s merely a bible study and not a church. In his game room are 140 seats, a podium and a portrait of the last supper. You know, like a church. There’s a six foot white cross on his front lawn next to a four by eight foot sign for announcements. You know, like you’d see in front of a church. 50 or more people (numbers vary depending on who you ask) gather there every Sunday to hear Michael Salman, who they call “pastor”, talk about the bible for 1-2 hours. You know, like a church.



* Cops and city inspectors remind him that they said he can’t have a church there. They also point out that his game room is horribly unsafe and there’s a reason commercial zoning is different than residential. See, if you plan on having over 50 people in a place on a weekly basis, you need to make sure that there’s fire sprinklers, properly marked exits, handicap access and permanent wiring as opposed to just a bunch of extension cords (just a few of the dozens of code violations).



* Salman gets warnings, tickets and numerous letters from the city stating he can’t have a church in his back yard. Rather than trying to reach a compromise with neighbors (all who hate him now. His next door neighbor successfully filed a restraining order against him) or complying with the city, he just keeps on Churching and ignoring everybody. Eventually the citations pile up and now he has to go to jail.


So there you go. Michael Salman didn’t go to jail for hosting a home bible study. Despite what Fox, Glenn Beck, The Examiner etc. would have you believe, nobody’s going to jail for having a few friends over to read the bible. Michael Salman went to jail for having a church in his backyard, lying about it, pissing off his neighbors, putting his parishioners in danger by gathering in an unsafe building and ignoring multiple warnings from the city. He’s not a martyr or an example of the erosion of religious freedoms. He’s a stubborn man who thinks religious freedom means immunity from everything.
 
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#70
#70
lawgator1 said:
* Neighbors fight Salman and win. He can’t build a church in his back yard.
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If the neighbors do not want Salman to build church in their neighborhood, they could have pooled money together and offered to buy his property. Other than that, Salman should have been able to build whatever he damn well pleased on his property.
 
#73
#73
therealUT said:
If the neighbors do not want Salman to build church in their neighborhood, they could have pooled money together and offered to buy his property. Other than that, Salman should have been able to build whatever he damn well pleased on his property.
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If I buy all the lots around you and open up all night amusement parks that tower over your property, that okay with you?
 
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