Derek Chauvin trial

#351
#351
NurseGoodVol said:
It doesn’t, no petechial hemorrhage or bruising in the neck or upper back area. His heart condition coupled with drugs killed him.
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If that's the case then why did two ME's list death as homicide? It's a serious question because the ME's report contains conflicting info.
 
#352
#352
NurseGoodVol said:
His larynx and hyoid were intact. No evidence of compression like petechial hemorrhaging or bruising in the neck and upper back. His injuries were superficial on his face. He was a walking dead man the minute he swallowed the drugs. Did you read the autopsy report septic?
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You should call the M.E. and the other forensic pathologist that conducted the autopsy and explain how thier conclusions are too inconsistent for you.

They both said that the asphyxiation/MI were as a result of compression to the neck. A hyoid is usually broken through strangulation which is different force from compression, no?
 
#353
#353
NurseGoodVol said:
It doesn’t, no petechial hemorrhage or bruising in the neck or upper back area. His heart condition coupled with drugs killed him.
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You've seen the video, right? I mean, you do know that Chauvin had his knee on the dudes back and neck for ten minutes. Lol, wtf are you even talking about, the drugs and heart troubles were a loaded gun, but Chauvin pulled the trigger.
 
#355
#355
Septic said:
You've seen the video, right? I mean, you do know that Chauvin had his knee on the dudes back and neck for ten minutes. Lol, wtf are you even talking about, the drugs and heart troubles were a loaded gun, but Chauvin pulled the trigger.
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That makes sense. My only objection is that the first Autopsy ruled death due to Fentanyl or something to that effect. It seems like the second Autopsy could have been conducted with political motives in mind. I don’t think their conclusion is unreasonable I can just see a non medical rationale behind why they reversed the first decision
 
#357
#357
KB5252 said:
If that's the case then why did two ME's list death as homicide? It's a serious question because the ME's report contains conflicting info.
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It’s highly conflicting. His medical conditions, the blockages in his LAD 75% and most of his RCA
( both these supply the ventricles ) thickening of both his ventricles of the heart, no evidence of compression of breathing structure, no evidence of hemorrhaging or bruising in and around neck and back.
The statement of both ME’s about the condition of the lung tissue being inundated with fluid coupled with the above is pretty conclusive to his heart failing secondary to drug effect leading to pulmonary edema which caused his death. The whole time he was in custody fentanyl was leaching into his system slowly overriding the amphetamines.
Ignoring his statements about not being able to breathe were dangerous. He was drowning in his own lung fluid.
If he hadn’t passed that fake bill
If he wasn’t hopped up on amphetamines
If he hadn’t swallowed a lethal dose of fentanyl

If Chauvin didn’t show wanton disregard for the condition of someone in his custody and who he was responsible for

GF killed himself Chauvin is guilty of watching it happen without acting.
 
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#358
#358
Septic said:
You've seen the video, right? I mean, you do know that Chauvin had his knee on the dudes back and neck for ten minutes. Lol, wtf are you even talking about, the drugs and heart troubles were a loaded gun, but Chauvin pulled the trigger.
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Gf was a dead man before Chauvin did that. WTF I’M TALKING ABOUT is I think you’ve forgotten the pathophysiology of the disease processes present in gf coupled with the drugs in his system and the related outcomes. Once they cuffed him they were responsible for his welfare, Chauvin and the 2 others showed disregard of gf statements he couldn’t breath. If he sat next to the car with no pressure on him I feel pretty safe in saying he would have died. If he was put in the cruiser I feel pretty safe in saying he would have died. Fentanyl leaching into your system will do that. Along with the other cadre of drugs inside him.
 
#359
#359
hUTch2002 said:
For either side, what kind of man Floyd was, good or bad, is irrelevant. This kind of crap is what’s driving verdicts up in our country. I see it all the time with large truck accidents. Attorneys don’t argue the facts of what happened, they argue that the big bad trucking company killed this poor family person and so they need to pay, never mind that the poor family person was drunk, crossed center, and slammed into the truck that was steady in their lane and not speeding. That CDL driver should have seen it coming and/or the truck shouldn’t have been there.
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Lawyers: for the people.
 
#360
#360
NurseGoodVol said:
It’s highly conflicting. His medical conditions, the blockages in his LAD 75% and most of his RCA
( both these supply the ventricles ) thickening of both his ventricles of the heart, no evidence of compression of breathing structure, no evidence of hemorrhaging or bruising in and around neck and back.
The statement of both ME’s about the condition of the lung tissue being inundated with fluid coupled with the above is pretty conclusive to his heart failing secondary to drug effect leading to pulmonary edema which caused his death. The whole time he was in custody fentanyl was leaching into his system slowly overriding the amphetamines.
Ignoring his statements about not being able to breathe were dangerous. He was drowning in his own lung fluid.
If he hadn’t passed that fake bill
If he wasn’t hopped up on amphetamines
If he hadn’t swallowed a lethal dose of fentanyl

If Chauvin didn’t show wanton disregard for the condition of someone in his custody and who he was responsible for

GF killed himself Chauvin is guilty of watching it happen without acting.
Click to expand...
Interesting. Some is this I was not aware of.
 
Last edited:
#361
#361
Septic said:
You should call the M.E. and the other forensic pathologist that conducted the autopsy and explain how thier conclusions are too inconsistent for you.

They both said that the asphyxiation/MI were as a result of compression to the neck. A hyoid is usually broken through strangulation which is different force from compression, no?
Click to expand...
His brain did not show signs of vessel hemorrhaging, no petechial hemorrhaging in eyes, the process that killed him was solely in the chest with heart failing and pulmonary edema related to condition and drugs.
 
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#363
#363
NurseGoodVol said:
Gf was a dead man before Chauvin did that. WTF I’M TALKING ABOUT is I think you’ve forgotten the pathophysiology of the disease processes present in gf coupled with the drugs in his system and the related outcomes. Once they cuffed him they were responsible for his welfare, Chauvin and the 2 others showed disregard of gf statements he couldn’t breath. If he sat next to the car with no pressure on him I feel pretty safe in saying he would have died. If he was put in the cruiser I feel pretty safe in saying he would have died. Fentanyl leaching into your system will do that. Along with the other cadre of drugs inside him.
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You can theorize that he may have died without Chauvin putting his knee on GF's neck - and you may be right. However we can say for certain that the compression of the larynx resulted in either asphyxiation or an MI or both as was noted on the two autopsy's by the three pathologists as the cause of death.

Chauvin Trial: Fact-checking George Floyd's death and drug claims | khou.com

If the drugs and heart disease were what was ruled to have killed him, the manner of death would not have been ruled a homicide and Chauvin wouldn't be in the hot seat.

If someone gets shot in the chest and die and on autopsy they're found to Stage 4 have lung cancer and 99% blockage in the coronary artery's, the cause of death is still a GSW to the chest and ruled a homicide despite the fact that they were on deaths door already. In other words, what may have been is secondary to what is.
 
#364
#364
NurseGoodVol said:
His brain did not show signs of vessel hemorrhaging, no petechial hemorrhaging in eyes, the process that killed him was solely in the chest with heart failing and pulmonary edema related to condition and drugs.
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You don't know that.
 
#365
#365
Septic said:
You can theorize that he may have died without Chauvin putting his knee on GF's neck - and you may be right. However we can say for certain that the compression of the larynx resulted in either asphyxiation or an MI or both as was noted on the two autopsy's by the three pathologists as the cause of death.

Chauvin Trial: Fact-checking George Floyd's death and drug claims | khou.com

If the drugs and heart disease were what was ruled to have killed him, the manner of death would not have been ruled a homicide and Chauvin wouldn't be in the hot seat.

If someone gets shot in the chest and die and on autopsy they're found to Stage 4 have lung cancer and 99% blockage in the coronary artery's, the cause of death is still a GSW to the chest and ruled a homicide despite the fact that they were on deaths door already. In other words, what may have been is secondary to what is.
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Exactly. To say that Floyd died of a drug overdose is to make the completely unknowable claim that he was going to drop dead whether or not the cops ever touched him. It's to point to the video and say "You're watching that man OD."
 
#366
#366
We can look forward to the testimony of dueling medical experts. The prosecution's medical expert(s) will testify, with certainty, that the placement of Chauvin's knee on Floyd's neck (or back and neck) provided a direct physiological connection to every medical finding which is identified as causing or contributing to Floyd's death. The defense's medical expert(s) will testify, with certainty, that the placement of Chauvin's knee on Floyd's neck (or back and neck) provided no such physiological connection. But none of this expert testimony will be as compelling as the look on Chauvin's face captured on video. Floyd most likely would have died that afternoon no matter how he was restrained by the the police. But I believe Chauvin is going to jail, probably on the murder charge.
 
#368
#368
bamawriter said:
Exactly. To say that Floyd died of a drug overdose is to make the completely unknowable claim that he was going to drop dead whether or not the cops ever touched him. It's to point to the video and say "You're watching that man OD."
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But it's possible is it not? Especially considering we know the amount of drugs in his system was much greater than what is considered lethal. That is reasonable doubt.

Chauvin can be the worst pos on earth but is it possible Floyd OD'd?
 
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#369
#369
KB5252 said:
But it's possible is it not?
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Yes, it's possible. But it's also possible that had the cops not touched him he would have passed out, slept it off, and maybe woken up in the ER. It's also possible that he would have tripped on the curb, busted his head open, and died from his wounds.

Especially considering we know the amount of drugs in his system was much greater than what is considered lethal. That is reasonable doubt.
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That argument is going to require an affirmative defense. It's not going to be enough to say "he had a pharmacy coursing thru his veins." They're going to have to produce medical experts who will say "Chauvin didn't kill him. He was going to die within minutes no matter what."

Chauvin can be the worst pos on earth but is it possible Floyd OD'd?
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It's entirely possible. But that leads to the entire issue of depraved indifference on Chauvin's part. He held his knee to Floyd's neck for several minutes after Floyd had stopped breathing. He was clearly more concerned with the onlookers than the man underneath him. He hadn't drug tested Floyd, thus he could not have known how on the verge of ODing Floyd might have been. Floyd was in Chauvin's sole control, complained of distress, and became unresponsive, and Chauvin didn't give even half a damn.
 
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#372
#372
BigOrangeTrain said:
That’s a problem I have always worried about. How in the world can this case be fair and unbiased?
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That's why I will never sit on a high profile case. I'll tell the lawyers I know that neither of them don't give a damn about the truth, but I will commit to a fair trial and a swift hanging.
 
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