Electric Vehicles

#2,651
#2,651
NorthDallas40 said:
Back in the day I wanted a 928 but I’ve always been a fan of the 911 it’s timeless. Even today it’s their sexist car I think. At this point if I ever owned a Porsche it’d be a 911
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You can spend lots of time looking at all that are available on Bring a Trailer. That always leads me to looking at a number of other cars, then poof, there goes an hour.
 
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#2,653
#2,653
GoDucks349 said:
Saw a note yesterday that BMW and Toyota are making cars with hydrogen fueled engines. Don't know much about it at this point.

2023 Toyota Mirai | Toyota.com
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10,000 psi is massive and not sure How safe it is to pump it
I have spent my career in the air and gas industry and it is crazy dangerous pressure, regardless of the tank assurances
 
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#2,655
#2,655
Orangeburst said:
10,000 psi is massive and not sure How safe it is to pump it
I have spent my career in the air and gas industry and it is crazy dangerous pressure, regardless of the tank assurances
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There are others in this thread who may be more knowledgeable about it, but

this guy says 'the train has gone' / 'so many limitations' (saying this, while he's driving 30 minutes across town to his local hydrogen filling station)

 
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#2,656
#2,656
GoDucks349 said:
Saw a note yesterday that BMW and Toyota are making cars with hydrogen fueled engines. Don't know much about it at this point.

2023 Toyota Mirai | Toyota.com
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Hydrogen infrastructure is coming. My company is receiving multiple requests every week for reactor designs to remove O2 from “green hydrogen”. We have sold more than 1000 kg of palladium catalyst in the last 12 months to one global enterprise investing in green hydrogen but best known for their Diesel engines. Just this morning quoted 60 kg to a small gas company in India. Hydrogen powered cars can either use fuel cells or an internal combustion engine designed for hydrogen fuel. I hope I live to see H2 powered cars become competitive with EVs in terms of numbers on the road and numbers of refueling locations.
 
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#2,657
#2,657
RavinDave said:
Hydrogen infrastructure is coming. My company is receiving multiple requests every week for reactor designs to remove O2 from “green hydrogen”. We have sold more than 1000 kg of palladium catalyst in the last 12 months to one global enterprise investing in green hydrogen but best known for their Diesel engines. Just this morning quoted 60 kg to a small gas company in India. Hydrogen powered cars can either use fuel cells or an internal combustion engine designed for hydrogen fuel. I hope I live to see H2 powered cars become competitive with EVs in terms of numbers on the road and numbers of refueling locations.
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You could reach out to this guy with this news -- he wants to be positive as you, but so far he's saying "EV is superior" (he's saying this after having driven 30 min to get to the filling station)


 
#2,658
#2,658
Orangeburst said:
10,000 psi is massive and not sure How safe it is to pump it
I have spent my career in the air and gas industry and it is crazy dangerous pressure, regardless of the tank assurances
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They’ve got some high tech composite gas tanks to store it on vehicle and the literature thus far has indicated they pose no more a risk than any other fuel storage medium. I posted a link at one point in here on them.
 
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#2,663
#2,663
GoDucks349 said:
Saw a note yesterday that BMW and Toyota are making cars with hydrogen fueled engines. Don't know much about it at this point.

2023 Toyota Mirai | Toyota.com
Click to expand...
The Mirai has actually been around since 2014. It’s obvious Achilles heel is nationwide access to fuel. Newer processes using sea water electrolysis show promise of making hydrogen cheaper than gasoline but as long as the electrolysis plants are powered by fossil fuels that largely is the same situation as BEVs today on truly “green” hydrogen. They refer to the method I pointed to as blue hydrogen I believe.

Edit: no blue hydrogen isn’t from the method I described at least according to this source.

Blog - What is Green, Blue, and Brown Hydrogen? | AMOT
 
#2,664
#2,664
RavinDave said:
Yeah HEV vs BEV
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I am reminded of when I worked for a certain German company pretty solid in catalysts who partnered with Daimler on a methanol fueled car with an onboard reformer to produce H2 to power a fuel cell stack. It was called the Necar and made a coast-to-coast trip across the US. This was about 20 years ago. But methanol was not popular due to concerns about it getting into the groundwater.
 
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#2,665
#2,665
For the nerds ITT

NECAR 1, the fuel cell electric drive by Mercedes Benz, celebrates its 25th birthday since the German auto maker introduced the electric drive with fuel cell pack.

In 1994 Daimler-Benz AG introduces the NECAR with the name stands for “New Electric Car”. The electric current for the drive engine is generated by electrochemically converting hydrogen, the only by-product of which is water.

An entire series of other NECAR vehicles follows. The Mercedes-Benz GLC F-CELL, for example, incorporates the latest technology in a hybrid version (combined hydrogen consumption: 0.34 kg/100 km, combined CO2 emissions: 0 g/km, combined electrical consumption: 13.7 kWh/100 km*), which customers already use to get where they are going on an everyday basis.

25 years ago, the surprise is nothing short of perfect as Daimler-Benz AG invites the international press to Ulm on 13 April 1994. To the amazement of the journalists, however, they are not presented with the recently expanded research centre but instead with an innovative vehicle that features energy converting fuel cells designed to operate under everyday conditions.
 
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#2,666
#2,666
RavinDave said:
I am reminded of when I worked for a certain German company pretty solid in catalysts who partnered with Daimler on a methanol fueled car with an onboard reformer to produce H2 to power a fuel cell stack. It was called the Necar and made a coast-to-coast trip across the US. This was about 20 years ago. But methanol was not popular due to concerns about it getting into the groundwater.
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And battery powered electric vehicles have been around since the 1800’s they just had a monstrous Achilles heel using lead acid batteries. Today they have very efficient BLDC motors coupled to Lithium batteries, today ion one day maybe solid state. The means to make hydrogen available to the masses is just taking off. If fuel becomes as readily available as gasoline now I’d seriously consider one. I doubt I’ll ever consider a BEV. Just my own personal choice. And to be far a fuel cell has a small battery onboard also to handle power load dynamics and regenerative braking. But in the examples I’ve seen it’s about one tenth of the kWh of the current all battery EVs
 
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#2,668
#2,668
NorthDallas40 said:
And battery powered electric vehicles have been around since the 1800’s they just had a monstrous Achilles heel using lead acid batteries. Today they have very efficient BLDC motors coupled to Lithium batteries, today ion one day maybe solid state. The means to make hydrogen available to the masses is just taking off. If fuel becomes as readily available as gasoline now I’d seriously consider one. I doubt I’ll ever consider a BEV. Just my own personal choice. And to be far a fuel cell has a small battery onboard also to handle power load dynamics and regenerative braking. But in the examples I’ve seen it’s about one tenth of the kWh of the current all battery EVs
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I doubt I will ever buy a BEV either.
 
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#2,670
#2,670
RavinDave said:
I doubt I will ever buy a BEV either.
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If somebody wants one and finds them cool fine. They have very impressive performance in AWD configurations. I just think they’re intellectually lazy and disingenuously represented as saving the planet on the technology side. They are a midpoint I believe along the way to fuel cell EVs. They aren’t powered by unicorn farts yet anyway.
 
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#2,671
#2,671
NorthDallas40 said:
If somebody wants one and finds them cool fine. They have very impressive performance in AWD configurations. I just think they’re intellectually lazy and disingenuously represented as saving the planet on the technology side. They are a midpoint I believe along the way to fuel cell EVs. They aren’t powered by unicorn farts yet anyway.
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Back a couple years ago when I was still commuting a 50 mile round trip every day I was thinking about getting one. But since I started staying at the workplace I often go a week without driving 50 miles. At this rate I’ll not need another vehicle as long as we can still buy petrol.
 
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#2,673
#2,673
NorthDallas40 said:
The Mirai has actually been around since 2014. It’s obvious Achilles heel is nationwide access to fuel. Newer processes using sea water electrolysis show promise of making hydrogen cheaper than gasoline but as long as the electrolysis plants are powered by fossil fuels that largely is the same situation as BEVs today on truly “green” hydrogen. They refer to the method I pointed to as blue hydrogen I believe.

Edit: no blue hydrogen isn’t from the method I described at least according to this source.

Blog - What is Green, Blue, and Brown Hydrogen? | AMOT
Click to expand...
Blue hydrogen is from steam reforming of good ole natural gas. It is still how 95% of the H2 in the world is produced. The process is called SMR for steam methane reforming.
 
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#2,674
#2,674
Green hydrogen is made by electrolysis of water using power only from renewable sources e.g wind and solar. If you can claim credit for enough Renewable Natural Gas you may be able to claim credits for “green hydrogen” without a wind/solar powered electrolyzer, there are a lot of tricks in the trade.
 
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#2,675
#2,675
RavinDave said:
Blue hydrogen is from steam reforming of good ole natural gas. It is still how 95% of the H2 in the world is produced. The process is called SMR for steam methane reforming.
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I completely misinterpreted SMR when I read on this in one article. I thought they were referring to the new small modular reactor nukes of which several designs are in various stages of testing and prototyping. Yeah they’re referring to the dominant production method in use today which of course is fossil fuel powered. I posted an IEEE Spectrum link to a sea water electrolysis method which is in more advanced prototyping now and shows a great deal of process. There is hope on using water electrolysis to generate oxygen and hydrogen however fresh water isn’t necessarily an abundant resource and creates other issues. Sea water is the most abundant raw material on the planet and is renewable however.
 
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