HBO's "Game of Thrones"

[jakez4ut]

Now I wonder if Martin uses the show's ending to "test" the waters for his original concept.

It's pretty rare you can see what one vision of your story ending will be like in such a large scale way, if the fans truly hate it then it wouldn't surprised me if the book ending is different.

I also really, really hate how fans (some of you here) turn so quickly to essentially mocking/name calling people who feel/felt differently than you about the show or specific endings.


To me last night's episode arc would have been improved had Dany charged the Red Keep and lit up Cersei instead of essentially burning everything in the city. It would have been a small crack in an assumed huge dam that was Dany's sanity/mercy. You could have essentially triggered the exact same events, Grey Worm seeing Dany burn the keep still initiates on the Lannister army and the battle continues. Dany could have then "broke" even and continued her burning. Or she could have simply taken down the Red Keep and nothing else.

They wanted to make the last episode the "choice" between Jon and Dany, which unfortunately has created a divide and conflict among fans. A near copy of Civil War story from the MCU. One side vs the other, and thus to me at least the same sort of predictable unoriginal Hollywood conflict we see all the time. Which the story originally seemed to be avoiding who knows if this is Martin's true ending or not, and unfortunately we'll never know.

i think they wanted to drive the point home on her "madness" with the whole bells tolling deal. bells tolled....stop killing.

well...............eff that...err'body dies!! burn them all!

and this time there was no king slayer around to save everyone. the ones that could have done it, didn't when they had their chance and now are living with that mistake....'course, hindsight is always 2020....lol....

agree about the ultimate show down...hoping there's multiple players involved...would really like to see Sansa involved, as well as ayra. as pessimistic as i am about last night's episode, still very interested in next week's show.

 

[MoCo_Vol]

So biggest question with Jon...something no one else seems to be pointing out.

He's undead. Jon is a wight he's the "light" version of a wight. It's one secret the show hasn't used well, do we think people will accept a King who is raised from the dead for a religion they don't even follow in Westeros?


WHY ISN'T ANYONE TALKING ABOUT THIS?!?!

 

[jakez4ut]

So biggest question with Jon...something no one else seems to be pointing out.

He's undead. Jon is a wight he's the "light" version of a wight. It's one secret the show hasn't used well, do we think people will accept a King who is raised from the dead for a religion they don't even follow in Westeros?


WHY ISN'T ANYONE TALKING ABOUT THIS?!?!

well, there's only one episode left. and the red priests/priestesses are gone? and they kind of minimized that with how common it was to bring Beric back so many times.....so while it's a big deal, maybe it really isn't?

 

[MoCo_Vol]

i think they wanted to drive the point home on her "madness" with the whole bells tolling deal. bells tolled....stop killing.

well...............eff that...err'body dies!! burn them all!

and this time there was no king slayer around to save everyone. the ones that could have done it, didn't when they had their chance and now are living with that mistake....'course, hindsight is always 2020....lol....

agree about the ultimate show down...hoping there's multiple players involved...would really like to see Sansa involved, as well as ayra. as pessimistic as i am about last night's episode, still very interested in next week's show.

Yeah they did one thing, despite all the small things about last night that really didn't work for me. I CANNOT WAIT to see the last episode now. I kind of wish the conflict with Euron & Jaime had actually happened -after- he rescued Cersei. You basically get Euron wanting Cersei to go with him instead of Jaime and then the lie about the child drives the final wedge between Jaime and Cersei. Him and Euron battle, he wins but is mortally wounded and Cersei is trying to get him in the boat and then he kills her when she admits the child was a lie.

 

[zeppelin128]

There is also truth in hope and love.

There is, I just don't think this is that kind of story.

 

[MoCo_Vol]

well, there's only one episode left. and the red priests/priestesses are gone? and they kind of minimized that with how common it was to bring Beric back so many times.....so while it's a big deal, maybe it really isn't?

The Lord of Light is still a huge religion over the sea though, it's essentially the next crusade potentially to come to Westeros. Beric was also for the bulk of the season a wide spread "myth" of sorts, it wasn't until later in the show he became an accepted presence and even then it was an isolated thing to the North.

 

[eVOLve]

Things do have a way of coming full circle in the series. Jon has become Ned. Now the burning question will be whether he takes the throne for himself as Cersei described to Ned in Season 1.

Personally, I believe Jon will take down Dany, let Sansa rule and he'll move north of the wall.

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

well there's a reason the phrase "fairy tale endings" was coined.......

I never expected a fairy tale ending. That is a puny attempt at trivializing my feelings about this direction.

 

[zeppelin128]

Personally, I believe Jon will take down Dany, let Sansa rule and he'll move north of the wall.

Spin-off series of Jon, Tormund, and Ghost's antics and shenanigans north of the wall.

But seriously, I wonder if maybe Jon going north of the wall might be a bit too similar to Frodo's story in LOTR, and they might avoid it.

I agree that Jon will be involved in Dany's fall. I'm just not sure he survives it.

 

[eVOLve]

all good points. and the difference between what she did in Essos vs. Westeros was the liberation of the Essos cities and it's slaves. i think it was pretty clear upon her arrival in Westeros, no one really needed liberating. she was there to conquer. it's still a curious path to believe in liberating those cities in the East, to be their mother....and get to KL and have zero issue, mad as she may be at that point, and burn everyone, indiscriminantly.

she was actually probably fortunate that there was the WW threat that got her "in" with the North, fragile as that may have been.

otherwise, it may have been a battle as soon as she set foot on Dragonstone. there was no way she was going to win hearts and minds in Westeros, and even with the win over the WW, she gave no time for politics to even play a part. plus, they were so effective at thwarting that threat, that those in the South never even knew how big a threat that was to begin with...it didn't happen to them, so they probably wouldn't have ever seen the value.

LSS, whereas with the other main players for the throne, that played the game....Dany was never going to be part of that, and by her own admision of wanting to break that wheel, i guess you could definitely argue that there was never going to be a nuanced story for her on this side of the ocean.

so short of being angry about the episode, and i'm not, there were a few things missing, as a fan, that fell flat...a) you don't, and never were, going to get that game played with Dany as a center figure like you did with pretty much every other main character....b) for the most part, i don't think you got the satisfaction you wanted in some of the deaths that occurred....aside from the gleganes, i really wanted Euron's niece to take him out....i guess she's done, just chillin' on the iron isles? definitely didn't get the kinda death for jamie and cerci you wanted, no big confrotation, just very unceremoniously taken out....i'm like Sansa....i guess we'll never get to see her executed....talk about some foreshadowing lol.

i did like how quybon got got though...that was funny.

anywho......

She liberated cities to build an army. She pulled the emotional and dramatic flair to make them follow, fight and die for her. She only helped Jon for personal gain. She knew the whitewalkers stood in her way of the throne and the only reason she fell in love with Jon is because she thought he could be manipulated therefore be able to manipulate the people of Westeros.

 

[MoCo_Vol]

There's a good chance Arya is made to watch Dany execute Jon in front of a crowd the same way she had to watch Ned get beheaded.

Jon essentially bends the knee to Dany, despite his mistrust and she executes him in front of everyone to instill that "fear" she wants to lead by. Arya in the same crowd scene she was when her father was beheaded.

 

[jakez4ut]

Yeah they did one thing, despite all the small things about last night that really didn't work for me. I CANNOT WAIT to see the last episode now. I kind of wish the conflict with Euron & Jaime had actually happened -after- he rescued Cersei. You basically get Euron wanting Cersei to go with him instead of Jaime and then the lie about the child drives the final wedge between Jaime and Cersei. Him and Euron battle, he wins but is mortally wounded and Cersei is trying to get him in the boat and then he kills her when she admits the child was a lie.

yeah, good point, never even got to the baby swapping father story.....Jamie was sucha dope. really, he was a weak minded fool....lol.

 

[jakez4ut]

I never expected a fairy tale ending. That is a puny attempt at trivializing my feelings about this direction.

we all know your feelings on it. my post was more about perspective than anything else.....

 

[jakez4ut]

She liberated cities to build an army. She pulled the emotional and dramatic flair to make them follow, fight and die for her. She only helped Jon for personal gain. She knew the whitewalkers stood in her way of the throne and the only reason she fell in love with Jon is because she thought he could be manipulated therefore be able to manipulate the people of Westeros.

fair.

 

[jakez4ut]

There's a good chance Arya is made to watch Dany execute Jon in front of a crowd the same way she had to watch Ned get beheaded.

Jon essentially bends the knee to Dany, despite his mistrust and she executes him in front of everyone to instill that "fear" she wants to lead by. Arya in the same crowd scene she was when her father was beheaded.

that would suck.

 

[MoCo_Vol]

yeah, good point, never even got to the baby swapping father story.....Jamie was sucha dope. really, he was a weak minded fool....lol.

Sadly after a 7+ season redemption story that's exactly what they did to him. "I can't quit you" cliche as all get out, thanks a lot D&D. I also find it kind of sad that after every episode the writers are doing these little "here's why we made this dumb decision" interview. Was that a thing in the first seasons, I don't recall interview recaps following the episode.

 

[jakez4ut]

Spin-off series of Jon, Tormund, and Ghost's antics and shenanigans north of the wall.

But seriously, I wonder if maybe Jon going north of the wall might be a bit too similar to Frodo's story in LOTR, and they might avoid it.

I agree that Jon will be involved in Dany's fall. I'm just not sure he survives it.

i won't be surprised if both dany and jon are both dead in the end.

 

[TheDeeble]

Agree with most here. Very rushed. But Dany going the Mad King route has had the groundwork laid for multiple seasons.

Can Bran see the future unknowingly? Think back to season 6 right after Hold the Door before Meera and Bran run into Benjen Stark. Bran is having some visions. The Mad King yelling "Burn them all" mixed in with others. One of those visions was the shadow of a dragon flying over red rooftops. We saw that same scene last night when Drogon/Dany decided to burn King's Landing. They did a shot of a dragon shadow over rooftops, but this time it was extended to show Drogon.

I'd just assumed back then that it was a vision of Aegon on his dragon when he began his conquest of Westeros. But I'm pretty sure it was nearly the exact same shot, if not the identical one from his vision.

 

[VolsSportsFan]

Personally, I believe Jon will take down Dany, let Sansa rule and he'll move north of the wall.

Spoiler

The leaked ending I read is that this happens and he goes North. He reunites with Ghost and Bran helps rebuild the wall with some kind of magic (not sure about this part, it was fuzzy). He can't find Tormund and others so he goes past the wall and comes across corpes in the spiral (didn't say if Tormund is one of them or not), indicating the White Walkers are not wiped out. And then the series ends on that shot.

I've heard they filmed different endings so who knows, but I will say the same source had a leak for last night's episode and it was pretty much 100% what happened, so we'll see.

 

[VolsSportsFan]

There's a good chance Arya is made to watch Dany execute Jon in front of a crowd the same way she had to watch Ned get beheaded.

Jon essentially bends the knee to Dany, despite his mistrust and she executes him in front of everyone to instill that "fear" she wants to lead by. Arya in the same crowd scene she was when her father was beheaded.

I would absolutely hate that ending.

 

[gainesvol82]

What color eyes she got?

Greenish purple

 

[RikidyBones]

Have you not read all the posts here?It seems like everybody besides me is fine with this.

The show watchers arent going to pick up the books. They are off the train the moment the final credits roll unless we get bloopers at the end with Jamie farting in that bath when he was with Brienne in KL.

 

[zeppelin128]

yeah, good point, never even got to the baby swapping father story.....Jamie was sucha dope. really, he was a weak minded fool....lol.

He did say in the episode that he was the weakest Lannister. Guess he was right.

 

[jakez4ut]

Sadly after a 7+ season redemption story that's exactly what they did to him. "I can't quit you" cliche as all get out, thanks a lot D&D. I also find it kind of sad that after every episode the writers are doing these little "here's why we made this dumb decision" interview. Was that a thing in the first seasons, I don't recall interview recaps following the episode.

yeah, they try to explain it....but neither are great salesmen....they have the personalities of a coffee cup imo lol.

as for Jamie, if you think about it, they've been setting up him as a rube too. his father never thought he was the man he was supposed to be, Cerci, as much love as she had for him, really just saw him as a means to an end. the only one who "really" loved him was Tyrian, and that, again was a giant sign of weakness.........

and in that last scene with Brienne, now looking back on it, you can definitley see the "i can't quit her if i tried" mentality....

eh, either way, they could have completed the redemption story line if they wanted to, that was an arc that was available as well...and it would have sat well with fans just fine.....

 

[eVOLve]

Spoiler

The leaked ending I read is that this happens and he goes North. He reunites with Ghost and Bran helps rebuild the wall with some kind of magic (not sure about this part, it was fuzzy). He can't find Tormund and others so he goes past the wall and comes across corpes in the spiral (didn't say if Tormund is one of them or not), indicating the White Walkers are not wiped out. And then the series ends on that shot.

I've heard they filmed different endings so who knows, but I will say the same source had a leak for last night's episode and it was pretty much 100% what happened, so we'll see.

Makes the most sense to me.