Keystone Pipeline - a red line?

#251
#251
Septic said:
You've clearly confused me with someone who is against fracking or alternative energy sources.

That said, save your patriotic 'murica grandstanding for someone that thinks you have an opinion worth hearing.

I simply pointed out that NC lawmakers are trying to make it a FELONY to disclose the ingredients of fracking fluids. Seems odd if those fluids are nothing more than sand, water and lima beans. No?

That was in response to the mouthbeathers who moronically think that oil company's somehow care about anything other than profit.

I find it ironic that such a christian man such as yourself would intentionally go out of their way to pollute the earth and that you're so willing to go out of your way to piss off your neighbors. It pleases me to see you take this position, let the anger flow.
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Stealing anything over $1000 is a felony in NC. Id say releasing proprietary information on the most important part of a $10 Million well is worth more than $1000.
 
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#252
#252
VolsNSkinsFan said:
Stealing anything over $1000 is a felony in NC. Id say releasing proprietary information on the most important part of a $10 Million well is worth more than $1000.
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RTFA. It's not about stealing.

They don't want the public to to know about the lima beans, they're special.
 
#257
#257
marcusluvsvols said:
I live in NC just like you do septic. I support fracking and offshore drilling all over the Carolinas. I don't have a dime invested in oil. I support American businesses getting free from the tree hugging legislations and regulation that has crippled our economy. I don't give a damn if a spotted spread-toed flying field mouse gets displaced by a nuclear powerplant...or an oil rig. Neither do 95% ofAmericans its just that the whiny liberal douchebags scream so loud they are always heard...and business sufferI try to make my carbon footprint so large as to offset 10 or 15 of these shrub huggers on any given day. I only recycle if my regular trashcan gets full. I use old oil from my truck to kill weeds...and i enjoy the fact that my tree hugging next door neighbor just ccan't stand it. 'Mericuh.
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Amazing how many unpaid shills the energy industry has in this country.
 
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#258
#258
Septic said:
You've clearly confused me with someone who is against fracking or alternative energy sources.

That said, save your patriotic 'murica grandstanding for someone that thinks you have an opinion worth hearing.

I simply pointed out that NC lawmakers are trying to make it a FELONY to disclose the ingredients of fracking fluids. Seems odd if those fluids are nothing more than sand, water and lima beans. No?

That was in response to the mouthbeathers who moronically think that oil company's somehow care about anything other than profit.

I find it ironic that such a christian man such as yourself would intentionally go out of their way to pollute the earth and that you're so willing to go out of your way to piss off your neighbors. It pleases me to see you take this position, let the anger flow.
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You assume far too much. don't go out of my way to pollute anything. Nothing in my post implied that I do. I dispose of my motor oil.. In my yard...and don't care what my neighbor or any other shrub hugger thinks about it. Recycling is the same way. I dispose of my trash...my way...on my property and only use the recycle can if I run out of room. I do enjoy that it rustles my neighbors jimmies because he cares more about some stupid tree frog in south america than he does about teaching his obnoxious hippy kids to clean themselves properly and treat him with a lil respect. He's one of those "I'd never spank my kids" types. They lead to azzholes like you. Your parents did none of us any favors I assure you...least of all you.
 
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#259
#259
Velo you can pretty much just substitute your name right in there with his. I'm sure you're a tree hugger too. Mother Gaia and such. Good luck with that.
 
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#260
#260
marcusluvsvols said:
You assume far too much. don't go out of my way to pollute anything. Nothing in my post implied that I do. I dispose of my motor oil.. In my yard...and don't care what my neighbor or any other shrub hugger thinks about it. Recycling is the same way. I dispose of my trash...my way...on my property and only use the recycle can if I run out of room. I do enjoy that it rustles my neighbors jimmies because he cares more about some stupid tree frog in south america than he does about teaching his obnoxious hippy kids to clean themselves properly and treat him with a lil respect. He's one of those "I'd never spank my kids" types. They lead to azzholes like you. Your parents did none of us any favors I assure you...least of all you.
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Somebody is grumpy greenbeans. Did my post hit too close to home. WWJD?
 
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#262
#262
FLVOL69 said:
Grumpy green beans ? Wtf
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Owned eh?

If being proud of pouring motor oil in your yard to kill weeds to piss off your neighbors is "owning" then I suppose thats a word one could choose.

I'd say I've certainly been out rednecked.

You can go with owned though, whatever helps you sleep better.
 
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#264
#264
VolsNSkinsFan said:
Lies? I'm posting articles from 7 days ago and you are posting articles from 30 months ago that use the word "probably" and "maybe"

Just admit it, you hate the Oil and Gas Industry
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Now you are telling lies about me, something else you know nothing about. So, would you like to correct a few of your important positions which have proven to be false? Or would you like to continue diverting attention from them by creating meaningless disputes? Or will you evade the points at issue altogether with silly personal insults? Perhaps you already forgot the false statements you made about important issues. Do you need me to jog your memory...again?
 
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#265
#265
MG1968 said:
I'll stop being one as soon as I can use solar and wind power to drive my 1997 Cavalier back and forth to work.
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Not that you are, because I haven't seen enough from you on this subject to know...but realizing the importance of the oil industry does not require a person to become a shill or a stooge. I know that we do not now have a good substitute for gasoline and diesel, in many applications. Alternative technologies are getting better, but I do not think that there is going to be a sudden transition, like there was from horse to internal combustion engine. As for myself, I've done enough work in the oil industry to appreciate it. SkinsFan's accusation that I hate it is completely false. So I agree with you that our oil industry continues to be very important. But that does NOT mean that you or anyone should tell lies for it.
 
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#266
#266
MG1968 said:
I'll stop being one as soon as I can use solar and wind power to drive my 1997 Cavalier back and forth to work.
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97 cavalier???

How many miles on the odometer? Im guessing over 300k
 
#268
#268
Vol Main. Where would you rather get crude oil from. Venezuela or Canada? Would you like to export excess gasoline or would you rather import gasoline b/c demand isn't met by our refineries?
 
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#269
#269
VolsNSkinsFan said:
Vol Main. Where would you rather get crude oil from. Venezuela or Canada? Would you like to export excess gasoline or would you rather import gasoline b/c demand isn't met by our refineries?
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This has been an interesting back and forth. This threads shows the division of the two sides on the pipeline.

Do we not import the majority of our crude oil and refine it or do we also import refined oil ?

I have not researched, I have always assumed we refined all of our fuel and only imported crude.
 
#270
#270
Gramps said:
This has been an interesting back and forth. This threads shows the division of the two sides on the pipeline.

Do we not import the majority of our crude oil and refine it or do we also import refined oil ?

I have not researched, I have always assumed we refined all of our fuel and only imported crude.
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We import both crude, refined and used product. We even import natural gas, all are globally traded commodities.

Some of the pipeline detractors comments are accurate, some of the Canadian oil and refined product from it will be exported. Where they miss the big picture is that petroleum products are a globally traded commodity so the more product on the market coming from stable areas, the lower the price.
 
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#271
#271
hog88 said:
We import both crude, refined and used product. We even import natural gas, all are globally traded commodities.

Some of the pipeline detractors comments are accurate, some of the Canadian oil and refined product from it will be exported. Where they miss the big picture is that petroleum products are a globally traded commodity so the more product on the market coming from stable areas, the lower the price.
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Thank you Hog.
 
#272
#272
Most of our crude oil was imported until fairly recently. Now, domestic production provides just over one half of our consumption. You need to bear in mind the huge numbers and many nations involved in producing, refining, and shipping. We want simple answers to simple questions, but the international oil business is complicated in ways we might not understand or imagine. Looking at a diagramed map or a chart of U.S. oil product trade will begin to give an idea of what I mean. As for supply and demand, OPEC is a cartel. Production is determined by decisions, not by the maximum number of barrels from all of the wells. If an outside member such as Canada adds enough oil to the market to reduce prices, the cartel can reduce production to avoid over supply. OPEC does increase and decrease production to affect supply and prices. It happens, so don't get too dreamy over Canada lowering prices for us. Canada is acting to increase prices, as I've previously explained. I am not saying that none of the KXL shipped oil will be sold to U.S. buyers, but TransCanada plans to sell all it can from KXL to foreign buyers. It is already signing contracts with foreign companies and raising prices on American buyers supplied with already existing pipelines.

Forget the idea that everybody pays the same price for oil. Even in the U.S., prices in local markets throughout middle America differ from the international price of Brent. WTI light sweet crude is marked to the market with a discount, usually around 10% lower than Brent light sweet crude. If Keystone is connected, that discount probably will no longer exist. People need to understand that prices should go up when Keystone is connected, not down. There is no intention to fill the U.S. market with products from Canadian oil and then export the rest. That is a false fabrication of the mind. The plan is to export as much as possible to foreign buyers, for the highest possible prices, while increasing prices for U.S. buyers. That is the truth. The other stories are dreams and lies.
 
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#273
#273
Great non answer. Well done

Edit: you also keep saying Transcanada is going to sell the oil to foreign buyers, when it's illegal to export oil. So you really meant to say is that Transcanada is going to sell crude to US refineries like Exxon, Valero, Chevron etc and they will refine it into gasoline, and turn around and sell it to either America buyers or foreign.
 
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#274
#274
Vol Main said:
Most of our crude oil was imported until fairly recently. Now, domestic production provides just over one half of our consumption. You need to bear in mind the huge numbers and many nations involved in producing, refining, and shipping. We want simple answers to simple questions, but the international oil business is complicated in ways we might not understand or imagine. Looking at a diagramed map or a chart of U.S. oil product trade will begin to give an idea of what I mean. As for supply and demand, OPEC is a cartel. Production is determined by decisions, not by the maximum number of barrels from all of the wells. If an outside member such as Canada adds enough oil to the market to reduce prices, the cartel can reduce production to avoid over supply. OPEC does increase and decrease production to affect supply and prices. It happens, so don't get too dreamy over Canada lowering prices for us. Canada is acting to increase prices, as I've previously explained. I am not saying that none of the KXL shipped oil will be sold to U.S. buyers, but TransCanada plans to sell all it can from KXL to foreign buyers. It is already signing contracts with foreign companies and raising prices on American buyers supplied with already existing pipelines.

Forget the idea that everybody pays the same price for oil. Even in the U.S., prices in local markets throughout middle America differ from the international price of Brent. WTI light sweet crude is marked to the market with a discount, usually around 10% lower than Brent light sweet crude. If Keystone is connected, that discount probably will no longer exist. People need to understand that prices should go up when Keystone is connected, not down. There is no intention to fill the U.S. market with products from Canadian oil and then export the rest. That is a false fabrication of the mind. The plan is to export as much as possible to foreign buyers, for the highest possible prices, while increasing prices for U.S. buyers. That is the truth. The other stories are dreams and lies.
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How is putting more oil/refined product on the world market going to raise prices? With Russia producing and exporting as fast as they can, add Canada and our own production it reduces OPEC's ability to manipulate supply. That means less volatility.

But nice copy and paste of someone's talking points.
 
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#275
#275
hog88 said:
How is putting more oil/refined product on the world market going to raise prices? With Russia producing and exporting as fast as they can, add Canada and our own production it reduces OPEC's ability to manipulate supply. That means less volatility.

But nice copy and paste of someone's talking points.
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My post is not a copy and paste job, so why did you say that? Those are MY WORDS. I am sorry that you are not able to understand them. Let me speak of local markets again. Go to google and find quotes for oil prices. Look at Brent and then look at WTI. The prices are not the same. You cannot dispute that. It's a effing fact. The question to consider is why the prices are different. WTI is lower than Brent. Why? Brent is the price of light sweet on the international market. WTI is the price of light sweet crude on a local market, that is the price in middle America for oil produced in the American West. Since you choose to insult me instead of taking advantage of my generosity, go do the work your own damn self. You can say a lot of stupid things, but you cannot change the fact that the prices are not the same. The price of WTI is lower. Tell us why or STHU. That will be the answer to your question. Hint: you are talking about putting oil from our local market on the international market.
 
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