Keystone Pipeline - a red line?

#1,202
#1,202
PKT_VOL said:
You seem to think climate change/sustainability will be won by policy instead of technology. That's an incorrect assumption.
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Don't blame him. The state selected his history books. He's been taught "things were bad, and then government....."
 
#1,204
#1,204
2ez2dv8 said:
I don't disagree however, if we do not take full advantage of the Canadian oil sand resources China (who acquired Canadian oil giant Nexen) certainly will and we all are too aware of their overall environmental record. 2015 Nexen experienced a 1.3+ million gallon spill in Northern Alberta
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like I have said, I am for the pipeline. but fast tracking and cutting corners isn't going to put us ahead. I would rather take a while, get the job done right the first time and not have the headaches that are coming with this. again the unrest up there is real.

this is clearly a case where lobbists have bought policy
 
#1,205
#1,205
LouderVol said:
like I have said, I am for the pipeline. but fast tracking and cutting corners isn't going to put us ahead. I would rather take a while, get the job done right the first time and not have the headaches that are coming with this. again the unrest up there is real.

this is clearly a case where lobbists have bought policy
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Nothing is being fast tracked, all safety and procurement protocols will be followed.
 
#1,206
#1,206
LouderVol said:
like I have said, I am for the pipeline. but fast tracking and cutting corners isn't going to put us ahead. I would rather take a while, get the job done right the first time and not have the headaches that are coming with this. again the unrest up there is real.

this is clearly a case where lobbists have bought policy
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Take longer than eight years?

How many more studies do you believe are needed? .
 
#1,207
#1,207
Grand Vol said:
He never would have approved it regardless of the price per barrel.

The entire move was an appeasement to the environmental crowd.
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If he had a non-flexible stance to that end he could have simply announced it on day one, like the Gitmo policy.

What was there to gain from stringing the environmental crowd out for years?

2ez2dv8 said:
Insensitive. Offensive. Tasteless
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To 9/11 truthers?
 
#1,208
#1,208
Velo Vol said:
If he had a non-flexible stance to that end he could have simply announced it on day one, like the Gitmo policy.

What was there to gain from stringing the environmental crowd out for years?
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You could ask the same question of why string out TransCanada for that long as well. Most of the studies were done by the end of 2011, yet he didn't officially x-nay it until 2015.

And there was plenty to gain by "stringing out" the environmental crowd. It's called votes in 2012.
 
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#1,213
#1,213
Vol8188 said:
Lol at the "fair" trade BS. How does cheap steel hurt us? It doesn't.
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Exactly. American manufacturers and employees should lower their standard of living to equal that of third world and in some cases government subsidized entities in order to compete.
 
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#1,214
#1,214
Vol8188 said:
Hog,
Serious question:

If we were to subsidize oil or any other thing that we produce and another country bought it without imposing any tariffs on us,

Do you truly believe the other country would be losing out? Or would we be the ones losing?
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We don't need any other country's oil. We have enough of our own. There is a reservoir off the coast that can run our entire country for 100 years. This is just one spot.
 
#1,216
#1,216
Grand Vol said:
Take longer than eight years?

How many more studies do you believe are needed? .
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1 good one. apparently it hasn't been done. The specialists they brought in to record the culturally significant places never once consulted the tribes. and literally only studied the path of travel of the pipe, ignoring sensitive locations right next to the path that would have to be destroyed/disturbed.

The government identified about 400 some odd locations of import, and said only 20 were being disturbed. If that was the case I would be happy. according to the locals there are almost 1000 locations and more than half are being disturbed. and then you have the cases like my link where the guys building it go out of their way to destroy something. and you still have cases where they are building the pipes right next to lakes and other sources of drinking water.

any other "race" but Natives and this would be a complete outrage. and no I am not one of them I just call the bull**** as I see it.
 
#1,217
#1,217
LouderVol said:
1 good one. apparently it hasn't been done. The specialists they brought in to record the culturally significant places never once consulted the tribes. and literally only studied the path of travel of the pipe, ignoring sensitive locations right next to the path that would have to be destroyed/disturbed.

The government identified about 400 some odd locations of import, and said only 20 were being disturbed. If that was the case I would be happy. according to the locals there are almost 1000 locations and more than half are being disturbed. and then you have the cases like my link where the guys building it go out of their way to destroy something. and you still have cases where they are building the pipes right next to lakes and other sources of drinking water.

any other "race" but Natives and this would be a complete outrage. and no I am not one of them I just call the bull**** as I see it.
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I have to disagree with the last statement - a tremendous amount of construction is halting and cancelled based on Native American objection on sacred land issues.

My uncle does this type work all the time (identifying and documenting the Native side of the issue). There are many mandates that these impact studies must be done.

People like you and I do not have these specific protections and are limited to environmental concerns.
 
#1,218
#1,218
Grand Vol said:
You could ask the same question of why string out TransCanada for that long as well. Most of the studies were done by the end of 2011, yet he didn't officially x-nay it until 2015.

And there was plenty to gain by "stringing out" the environmental crowd. It's called votes in 2012.
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Absolutely to the bolded. He tried to avoid putting Dems in difficult positions in states/districts where there was support for the pipeline.

Same reason Dems didn't put forth a budget for 3 or 4 years - avoid being on the record with decisions that might cost them votes.
 
#1,221
#1,221
Have any of the opponents of this pipeline ever looked at how this oil is moved currently? The oil is going to come, it's just a matter of how.
I'd much rather have a pipeline than a train with a hundred cars filled with petroleum moving down the rails.
 
#1,222
#1,222
SpaceCoastVol said:
Exactly. American manufacturers and employees should lower their standard of living to equal that of third world and in some cases government subsidized entities in order to compete.
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Based on your response, you don't understand "standard of living". If we can buy cheaper goods, our standard of living increases.

The ability to make things cheaper (less time and effort) is what creates wealth.
 
#1,225
#1,225
Obsessed said:
We don't need any other country's oil. We have enough of our own. There is a reservoir off the coast that can run our entire country for 100 years. This is just one spot.
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You need to reread my post. It was a hypothetical about us exporting, not importing oil.
 
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