Lane Kiffin's 'dream job' will pay him $4 million. For ... what, again?

#176
#176
Sabanocchio said:
Those are just the facts that support your opinion. There are other facts that point to a competent coach who knows the ins and outs of competing and recruiting in the SEC and has the stuff to do it. You simply pick and choose which facts to repeat over and over because that's all you have.

All you have is a record that was tarnished by happenings out of the control of the coach in a year where they were expected to win big.

Let me ask you this, what games that Dooley lost do you profess he should have won?

Do you know that there is a thought that LA Tech will move to a better conference and soon? That's the sort of situation Dooley put them in. Boise State is on it's way out as well. It's inevitable.

He may fail miserably. But your "facts" hardly point to that.
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Yeah, going 17-20 and hiring a women's baasketball coach is the stuff legends are made of in this day and age. I bet the SEC will be looking to kick LSU out and bring the rising power from Ruston in to take their spot.
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#177
#177
tvolsfan said:
The ACC has been horrible for some time now, but there champions throughout the past aren't all teams that would go 4-4 in SEC play. Boise State's would have gone 4-4 if they played Tennessee's schedule this past year.


Good for him for winning a bowl at a team that hasn't done it in so long, but it means less when they add more crap bowls each year.


Chizik is awful. He may have been a good DC, but his head coaching resume looks even less impressive than Dooley's. He took a team averaging more than 6 wins over the 7 years before he was hired, and then proceeded to win 5 in 2 years. The year he's gone,they win 7, again. You can argue that it was with his recruits, but his record was substantially worse than the unknown coaches that coached before and after him. He had an overrated season with a team that had won an average of 11 games over the 4 years before the 2008 aberration, and will never win the conference title.


I don't believe that. Most of them just think UT will be awful. I doubt SMG, Hat, and some of the other guys actually want UT to fail so they can maintain supremacy in an internet argument. People are negative because this hire looks ridiculously stupid considering Dooley's resume and the situation he's going to face. Maybe he'll be surprising. People who have worked around him seem impressed. However, it's a huge reach to say these people want Dooley to fail, just because they're negative.
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Chizik is going to be Saban's pinata. You can't stay employed by the Barn for long in that situation.
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#178
#178
hatvol96 said:
Yeah, going 17-20 and hiring a women's baasketball coach is the stuff legends are made of in this day and age. I bet the SEC will be looking to kick LSU out and bring the rising power from Ruston in to take their spot.
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In no way did I infer that Dooley is going to be legendary. I don't profess to know. And Tech is much more likely to join CUSA than the SEC. But, you didn't answe rmy question. You simply repeated his record....again....which is all you seem to do. That's your defense for your "Dooley will fail" theory. Losing record, crappy conference. That's just not enough.
 
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#179
#179
tvolsfan said:
The ACC has been horrible for some time now, but there champions throughout the past aren't all teams that would go 4-4 in SEC play. Boise State's would have gone 4-4 if they played Tennessee's schedule this past year.
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Boise State would have given many teams trouble. They would have likely beat UCLA. Any of our other wins could have just as likely been Boise State victories.

Good for him for winning a bowl at a team that hasn't done it in so long, but it means less when they add more crap bowls each year.
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You don't discount it. Period.
Chizik is awful. He may have been a good DC, but his head coaching resume looks even less impressive than Dooley's. He took a team averaging more than 6 wins over the 7 years before he was hired, and then proceeded to win 5 in 2 years. The year he's gone,they win 7, again. You can argue that it was with his recruits, but his record was substantially worse than the unknown coaches that coached before and after him. He had an overrated season with a team that had won an average of 11 games over the 4 years before the 2008 aberration, and will never win the conference title.
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We will see if your prediction holds true. I thought he would be awful as well, but he's super-organized, can recruit well enough to compete with Bama, Georgia, LSU, and he's surrounded himself with solid coaches. Early returns are good and now Malzahn has a QB that fits his system.
I don't believe that. Most of them just think UT will be awful. I doubt SMG, Hat, and some of the other guys actually want UT to fail so they can maintain supremacy in an internet argument. People are negative because this hire looks ridiculously stupid considering Dooley's resume and the situation he's going to face. Maybe he'll be surprising. People who have worked around him seem impressed. However, it's a huge reach to say these people want Dooley to fail, just because they're negative.
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It's not a reach at all. Some on here have said explicitly that they hope he fails. You're dead wrong.
 
#180
#180
Sabanocchio said:
In no way did I infer that Dooley is going to be legendary. And Tech is much more likely to join CUSA than the SEC. I don't profess to know. But, you didn't answe rmy question. You simply repeated his record....again....which is all you seem to do. That's your defense for your "Dooley will fail" theory. Losing record, crappy conference. That's just not enough.
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Yeah, why bring up his record? I should care that he did a decent of of kissing booster's asses and hired a women's basketball coach. Wait, no I shouldn't. Find me someone who was a loser in a garbage conference like the WAC, then went on to success in the big time. It's like making a guy who isn't smart enough to teach elementary school the president of Harvard. "He's incompetent at the lowest level of D-I. Let's bring him to the SEC." I can't imagine how that could fail.
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#181
#181
hatvol96 said:
Yeah, why bring up his record? I should care that he did a decent of of kissing booster's asses and hired a women's basketball coach. Wait, no I shouldn't. Find me someone who was a loser in a garbage conference like the WAC, then went on to success in the big time. It's like making a guy who isn't smart enough to teach elementary school the president of Harvard. "He's incompetent at the lowest level of D-I. Let's bring him to the SEC." I can't imagine how that could fail.
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Describe his incompetence. In what ways does he fall short of your ideal coach?
 
#182
#182
I'm with most of you. I WANT Dooley to succeed, because that means Tennessee football gets back in the limelight faster. I'm sure even hat would be won over if he did something like beat Nick Saban and win a bowl game in his first season or two.

But the facts are that he was a career so-so position coach for Nick Saban for the first chunk of the decade, then proceeded to post two wins in three seasons at LaTech over teams with a pulse (sort of).

The point that hat is making, albeit somewhat crudely, is that CDD has done absolutely nothing in his career to indicate he's got the stuff to succeed as a head coach in the SEC. History shows that good college coaches win and typically win immediately at whatever stop they're at. Sorry to say it, but anybody who believes he's got what it takes is probably making a real big reach.

I want to be optimistic but the reality is that it was a last-second desperation hire after getting left high and dry, and will probably not pan out. I would be ecstatic to see our guys back to beating Florida and/or Alabama every year, winning the division and playing on new years annually, but after seeing the same discussion here ad nauseum, I've decided for myself that there is no evidence showing he is the guy to succeed. I haven't seen an abundance of negative evidence either, but its there. I would expect that if Bob Stoops or Urban Meyer or Nick Saban or Jim Tressel were to step into the LATech HC job tomorrow, without their reputations, they would either outright win or get a share of the WAC title within two seasons.
 
#183
#183
Sabanocchio said:
Boise State would have given many teams trouble. They would have likely beat UCLA. Any of our other wins could have just as likely been Boise State victories.
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They don't beat Florida, or Bama, and they lose at least 2 out of South Carolina, Georgia, Ole Miss, Auburn, and Kentucky.

You don't discount it. Period.
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I'm saying it's really not that big of an accomplishment.

We will see if your prediction holds true. I thought he would be awful as well, but he's super-organized, can recruit well enough to compete with Bama, Georgia, LSU, and he's surrounded himself with solid coaches. Early returns are good and now Malzahn has a QB that fits his system.
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He's convinced a lot of people he's better than he is. Once Malzahn is gone, he can't sell early playing time, and people see he's not that special, his recruiting will suffer.

It's not a reach at all. Some on here have said explicitly that they hope he fails. You're dead wrong.
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Who? It can't be many. Some people are about 100% sure he'll fail, but I can't think of any specific person who actually said they want Dooley to fail so they can be proven right. The closest I remember seeing is someone saying he'd rather Dooley fail faster over 3 years than fail over 8 years.
 
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#184
#184
For comparison, lets look at the history of the first HC position of what I consider to be the four best coaches in the country at this time...

Nick Saban: Career assistant/position coach, notably as DB coach of the Houston Oilers before his first job at Toledo. The Rockets were an average program in a lower-level conference, coming off consecutive 6-5 seasons. Saban's first (and only) year he came in and went 9-2 and won a share of the MAC title. At Michigan State, he posted .500 or better records while under some heavy punishment by the NCAA, then led the Spartans to one of their best seasons in team history in '99.

Urban Meyer: With 11 years experience as a WR coach and coming out of Notre Dame, he stepped into lowly Bowling Green and posted a 17-6 record. I don't need to say anything about his success at Utah.

Jim Tressel: His only HC stop before Ohio State was at Youngstown State, where he had arguably the most dominant D-IAA program throughout the late 80's and all of the 90's as both HC AND AD, making the national championship game six times and winning four of them.

Bob Stoops: Never held a HC job before Oklahoma, but generally did a solid job as DC at KState and Florida in the 90's.
 
#186
#186
milohimself said:
For comparison, lets look at the history of the first HC position of what I consider to be the four best coaches in the country at this time...

Nick Saban: Career assistant/position coach, notably as DB coach of the Houston Oilers before his first job at Toledo. The Rockets were an average program in a lower-level conference, coming off consecutive 6-5 seasons. Saban's first (and only) year he came in and went 9-2 and won a share of the MAC title. At Michigan State, he posted .500 or better records while under some heavy punishment by the NCAA, then led the Spartans to one of their best seasons in team history in '99.

Urban Meyer: With 11 years experience as a WR coach and coming out of Notre Dame, he stepped into lowly Bowling Green and posted a 17-6 record. I don't need to say anything about his success at Utah.

Jim Tressel: His only HC stop before Ohio State was at Youngstown State, where he had arguably the most dominant D-IAA program throughout the late 80's and all of the 90's as both HC AND AD, making the national championship game six times and winning four of them.

Bob Stoops: Never held a HC job before Oklahoma, but generally did a solid job as DC at KState and Florida in the 90's.
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Oklahoma was also oming off a wretched era when they hired him. They had had gone 5 straight seasons without a winning record. I don't remember, but I'm not sure how attractive the job would have been. Despite our recent struggles, our past 5 years look far better than their past 5.
 
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#187
#187
Sabanocchio said:
Describe his incompetence. In what ways does he fall short of your ideal coach?
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I'm missing where it complex to understand. He couldn't win in the WAC, yet you people have dreamed up some scenario under which he'll win in the SEC East. It's like asking a kid who can't hit in Little League to start in centerfield for the Yankees. Colorado hired a guy who was dominant in the WAC and he's been a disaster. Can't imagine why people expect a loser from that league to get his head handed to him by the Meyers and Sabans of the world.
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#189
#189
tvolsfan said:
You're going out on a limb with just about all of this. There's no legitimate way you can argue that he can't coach a lick, or at least put up a staff that can.
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The legitimate way to argue a coaches ability is to objectively look at his record.

Make two columns.

On the left write down the number of games the coach won that he should have lost.

On the right write down the number of games the coach lost that he should have won.

If the number on the left is zero and the number on the right is greater than zero, you're looking at a guy that can't coach a lick.
 
#190
#190
UT IE 95 said:
The legitimate way to argue a coaches ability is to objectively look at his record.

Make two columns.

On the left write down the number of games the coach won that he should have lost.

On the right write down the number of games the coach lost that he should have won.

If the number on the left is zero and the number on the right is greater than zero, you're looking at a guy that can't coach a lick.
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How do you think Fulmer would fare with that type of evaluation? I think he might fall into your "can't coach a lick" category.
 
#191
#191
It's disgusting how some of you "fans" bad mouth Dooley before he even coaches a single game. Even worse is how some of you can sit here and STILL give ANY props to Lane Kiffin. He would be nowhere if his daddy wasn't Monte Kiffin, and that's the bottom line that none of you can even try to argue against. He is a package deal with one of the best defensive coaches of all time, and also a pretty good recruiter in Ed Orgeron.

Be happy with the coach you managed to pull in under the circumstances.
 
#194
#194
wow i cant believe he could get this much

i dont think any of these guys got that much till they won a title
 
#196
#196
droski said:
you all defended kiffin when he was your coach. nothing about him has really changed.
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That's what makes me laugh.

The same idiots yelling "Lane Sucks" are the same ones yelling they were on the "Lane Train" this time last year.
 
#198
#198
justingroves said:
That's what makes me laugh.

The same idiots yelling "Lane Sucks" are the same ones yelling they were on the "Lane Train" this time last year.
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Of course, and they had no clue who Derek Dooley was last year and would have made fun of any SEC team that hired him.
 
#200
#200
droski said:
interestingly feldman on ESPN is saying that $4 mil figure is wrong and too high.
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It was reported during the HBO Real Sports interview with LK (I watched last night - not sure when it originated).

Interesting interview - pretty balanced.
 
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