New England Patriots Have Incredible Day

#101
#101
VKAman said:
Gonzo is always down, Clark was replaced well and Reggie Wayne is still better than Deion Branch...none of these seem like reasons for a "better" QB to throw 17 picks while the other throws 4, or reasons for said QB to throw less touchdowns with 200 more passes.
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Are you serious? "Gonzo is always hurt" is your argument? Wouldn't that make all of Manning's numbers more impressive?

These aren't even good arguments. They are biased. You mention Branch but ignore Welker. Why on earth would you push so hard against Manning? You ignore the facts that Brady had a very comfortable running game and a good defense. You can't even compare them. Against all odds, Manning's Colts made the playoffs. They had something like 17 starters miss significant time.
 
#102
#102
volfanjustin said:
Brady is very good, but I don't believe they won 3 SB because of him, their defenses were great. The best year he had stats wise and when he did his best they did not win it and his last 2 seasons have been really good but they were one and done both times.
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Then we agree to disagree
 
#104
#104
VKAman said:
Philip Rivers lost his top 3 receivers and was playing with Seyi Ajirotutu, but had a better season than Peyton and also destroyed him head-to-head. So there's one.
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SD didn't lose what the Colts lost, and Manning doesn't have Rivers' line.
 
#106
#106
nbakerld said:
Are you serious? "Gonzo is always hurt" is your argument? Wouldn't that make all of Manning's numbers more impressive?

These aren't even good arguments. They are biased. You mention Branch but ignore Welker. Why on earth would you push so hard against Manning? You ignore the facts that Brady had a very comfortable running game and a good defense. You can't even compare them. Against all odds, Manning's Colts made the playoffs. They had something like 17 starters miss significant time.
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People act like Peyton was facing the apocalypse last year. He was missing a receiver he's always missing, lost a TE that was fairly easily replaced and had a wideout that kept getting concussed. How did he survive in that meatgrinder of a division? I think the 17 picks had a lot more to do with Peyton himself than most Colts fans will admit. I don't think Jacob Tamme was the problem.
 
#108
#108
Manning threw a lot of picks, but a lot of his picks were the result of new blood being in the lineup. Their schemes rely on timing and communication. Manning's line is terrible. They can't run block, and they can barely pass block, but he is good about getting rid of the ball. Even with his average-at-best line he's #1 in sack%. He gets rid of the ball quickly. Sometimes he throws a pick, but he avoids a lot of drive killing sacks. A lot.

If you think Manning is pick-happy maybe you should look at stats from seasons where there weren't tons of injuries and he had a decent line. Even at his worst, Manning was still in the top half of the league in interception %. You guys mention he threw so many times his TD's are devalued, but you fail to recognize this invariably means he should throw more picks.
 
#109
#109
VKAman said:
People act like Peyton was facing the apocalypse last year. He was missing a receiver he's always missing, lost a TE that was fairly easily replaced and had a wideout that kept getting concussed. How did he survive in that meatgrinder of a division? I think the 17 picks had a lot more to do with Peyton himself than most Colts fans will admit. I don't think Jacob Tamme was the problem.
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His second, fourth and fifth best receivers missed a ton of time. Oline was a mix and match of guys, running back was a revolving door. Defensive secondary was terrible which put more pressure on him to score on every drive
 
#110
#110
nbakerld said:
Manning threw a lot of picks, but a lot of his picks were the result of new blood being in the lineup. Their schemes rely on timing and communication. Manning's line is terrible. They can't run block, and they can barely pass block, but he is good about getting rid of the ball. Even with his average-at-best line he's #1 in sack%. He gets rid of the ball quickly. Sometimes he throws a pick, but he avoids a lot of drive killing sacks. A lot.

If you think Manning is pick-happy maybe you should look at stats from seasons where there weren't tons of injuries and he had a decent line. Even at his worst, Manning was still in the top half of the league in interception %. You guys mention he threw so many times his TD's are devalued, but you fail to recognize this invariably means he should throw more picks.
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My question is, why did he throw 200 more times than Brady and still throw less touchdowns? And why does "more picks" mean 4x as many? And when has Peyton ever approached a 9:1 ratio? All different ways of asking pretty much the same thing. 36 TDs and 4 picks is unreal by pretty much any standard, and while Peyton may be the best ever, it's pretty clear who's the best now.
 
#111
#111
VKAman said:
People act like Peyton was facing the apocalypse last year. He was missing a receiver he's always missing, lost a TE that was fairly easily replaced and had a wideout that kept getting concussed. How did he survive in that meatgrinder of a division? I think the 17 picks had a lot more to do with Peyton himself than most Colts fans will admit. I don't think Jacob Tamme was the problem.
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You're not telling the truth. You mention 3 injuries and downplay those guy's role. Tamme played well, but Clark is an NFL top 100. Manning to Collie was the most dangerous combination in the NFL until he got injured. And there were much more injuries. Key injuries included:

RB's: Addai (8), Brown (3), Hart (9)
WR's: Collie (7), Gonzo (14), Garcon (2), White (3)
TE's: Clark (10)
OL: Johnson (1)
CB's: Hayden (5), Powers (6), Lacey (4), Tryon (4)
LB: Brackett (4), Hagler (3), Session (11)
S: Sanders (15), Bullitt (12)
DT: Johnson (2)

And they still won their division.
 
#113
#113
Manning had like the highest passer rating in the league for the first 6 weeks until the injuries mounted up and took their toll. 5 of the first 6 games he was 99+ in passer rating and only did it 3 times the rest of the season.

Go figure.
 
#116
#116
volfanjustin said:
Also one of these guys has more MVPs than anyone in the history of the league.
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2005 and 2006 might have been the 2nd and 3rd best years of his career, and he didn't win MVP in those 2. He could conceivably have 5 or 6 MVP's. 2006 was the last time they had a running game.
 
#117
#117
Manning had 2 INT's the first 7 weeks and 15 in the last 9 weeks. You can't tell me the injuries didn't play a role in that. Colts also led the league in drops, and I'm willing to bet picks off of WR's hands (maybe the Giants claim that, because I noticed they did it a lot too).
 
#118
#118
If I had to choose, I would pick Tom Brady. He is better in the playoffs. Manning's pick at the end of the super bowl comes to mind.
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#120
#120
865dude said:
If I had to choose, I would pick Tom Brady. He is better in the playoffs. Manning's pick at the end of the super bowl comes to mind.
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Brady's thrown picks in win/lose situations twice in the playoffs. Manning has done it once.

Also, in the last 6 years, Manning and Brady have the same playoff record, but Manning has more SB appearances and a title. Brady does not have a title over that stretch, and these are the best years of Brady's career. We're talking like 7-8 years of his prime and he hasn't won a title. If he's the winner we think he is, he should have a title. He's clearly had good enough teams.
 
#124
#124
BearCat204 said:
I would say that the Pats would be one of the favorites to represent the AFC this year. Dont see the Saints there
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One of the favorites yes but the AFC is very good at the top. There are 5 teams that have a legit shot at going from the AFC
 
#125
#125
Stopped reading after the first two pages. Few intelligent comments, lots of dumb ones. And the dumb comments aren't coming from the Titan fans. Well, one...
 
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