No one is Underpaid

[C-south]

No but neither are mechanics, heat/air techs, lawyers, accountants, police, welders, plumbers, architects, teachers, firemen, salesmen, truck drivers, ext and ext.

Exactly. Most people that perform those jobs have an actual skill that can’t be learned in a day or two as well.

 

[Vol423]

No but neither are mechanics, heat/air techs, lawyers, accountants, police, welders, plumbers, architects, teachers, firemen, salesmen, truck drivers, ext and ext.

Which is why earlier in this thread I drew the distinction between what the government classified as an "essential business" during the pandemic versus what actually is essential. Government classification as an "essential business" during the pandemic included a ton of businesses that weren't the least bit essential. However, it enabled the government to keep more people employed.

 

[LouderVol]

Are you working any of these positions yourself? If not, then yes it's a skilled position that you often depend on to get by each week. Maybe you should learn to show some respect for other people.

You and a few others simply see certain groups of workers as beneath you and even go out of your way to justify your views.

And if you and others are Christian I would highly suggest reading some scriptures.

Christ speaks towards what is skilled or not? I missed that part.

I pointed out in my post that defining a job as skilled vs unskilled does nothing to belittle a person working it. Does nothing to define them, or establish in quality about them except for a job they currently hold. Certainly doesnt invoke anything related to christ.

I always wanted to be an architect, I am one, i cant think of any job i would want to do other than this. So according to you literally every job is skilled for me, but the job I have. That makes no sense.

 

[hog88]

Which is why earlier in this thread I drew the distinction between what the government classified as an "essential business" during the pandemic versus what actually is essential. Government classification as an "essential business" during the pandemic included a ton of businesses that weren't the least bit essential. However, it enabled the government to keep more people employed.

The government should never and should never again be allowed to deem businesses essential or non-essential. If someone is willing to pay for that product or service it is essential.

 

[hog88]

Exactly. Most people that perform those jobs have an actual skill that can’t be learned in a day or two as well.

How long it takes to learn a job is irrelevant.

 

[C-south]

How long it takes to learn a job is irrelevant.

Not really. Just like being capable of learning a skill isn’t.

 

[hog88]

Not really. Just like being capable of learning a skill isn’t.

All jobs take some type of skill unless your job is sitting on your ass debating politics on the internet.

 

[C-south]

All jobs take some type of skill unless your job is sitting on your ass debating politics on the internet.

No, according to you that would be a skill.

 

[hog88]

No, according to you that would be a skill.

Some of us are more skilled at it than others.

 

[DonjoVol]

The government should never and should never again be allowed to deem businesses essential or non-essential. If someone is willing to pay for that product or service it is essential.

Exactly. And why people continue to argue this and make claims on who is skilled or unskilled is beyond me.

I actually had a friend of mine who made a post on Facebook. Basically he was upset that some of these restaurants were offering sign on bonuses to new applicants. Said those type of people didn't deserve sign on bonuses.

A few weeks later he said private businesses had every right to make their workers get vaccinated. One of his reasons for that is that they were a private a business and they can do what they want. But a few weeks earlier he was offended that private businesses were offering sign on bonuses.

Wish I was making that up but I'm not.

 

[WestTennesseeVol]

Lower pay in these fields leads to lower quality of applicants and higher turnover within the first five years. Why do we have so many ****** cops and teachers? Because we're only paying enough to attract ****** cops and teachers.

Hell, most teachers and police officers can’t even afford to live in the cities they work in on their salary alone. Mt. Juliet recently was hiring officers at $38k~ a year, which is laughable for the cost of living there. I see it first hand every year, good teachers and police officers quit their jobs and go make more money elsewhere.

 

[C-south]

Some of us are more skilled at it than others.

For sure.

 

[AshG]

Hell, most teachers and police officers can’t even afford to live in the cities they work in on their salary alone. Mt. Juliet recently was hiring officers at $38k~ a year, which is laughable for the cost of living there. I see it first hand every year, good teachers and police officers quit their jobs and go make more money elsewhere.

My children are eligible for Medicaid on my professor's salary combined with my wife's two jobs. We're staying the course as I get a decent salary bump when my line is converted to tenure track, but it's tight times.

 

[DonjoVol]

Christ speaks towards what is skilled or not? I missed that part.

I pointed out in my post that defining a job as skilled vs unskilled does nothing to belittle a person working it. Does nothing to define them, or establish in quality about them except for a job they currently hold. Certainly doesnt invoke anything related to christ.

I always wanted to be an architect, I am one, i cant think of any job i would want to do other than this. So according to you literally every job is skilled for me, but the job I have. That makes no sense.

If you order from Papa John's tonight and expect them to deliver you two pizzas they are providing you with a skilled service. It takes someone to make your food, another person to cut and box your pizza and another person to deliver it to you. The delivery driver could also be helping with step one and completing the tasks for step two. Plus they are taking on the risk delivering that food to you. If your order is correct then are satisfied and happy. Just as an architect you are providing people a skilled service. If people like your work then obviously they are satisfied and happy as well. You work in a skilled career and occupation. And so do the people who work at Papa John's. That's just where me and some people differ. I see people as equals.

 

[LouderVol]

If you order from Papa John's tonight and expect them to deliver you two pizzas they are providing you with a skilled service. It takes someone to make your food, another person to cut and box your pizza and another person to deliver it to you. The delivery driver could also be helping with step one and completing the tasks for step two. Plus they are taking on the risk delivering that food to you. If your order is correct then are satisfied and happy. Just as an architect you are providing people a skilled service. If people like your work then obviously they are satisfied and happy as well. You work in a skilled career and occupation. And so do the people who work at Papa John's. That's just where me and some people differ. I see people as equals.

People yes. I am no better than the people who work at papa johns. No one has ever said otherwise.

Our jobs however are two completely different beasts. And under pretty much any actual metric my job would be considered better than papa John's. That's not saying one iota about the people at either. In fact I would be far more likely to hang out with the papa John's crowd and consider them better people than most architects I know.

You are conflating people with their jobs. You seem to be the only one doing this. And you are casting your judgement against others on this board based on assumptions you have made about them or their arguments that is unsupported.

 

[TheDeeble]

If you order from Papa John's tonight and expect them to deliver you two pizzas they are providing you with a skilled service. It takes someone to make your food, another person to cut and box your pizza and another person to deliver it to you. The delivery driver could also be helping with step one and completing the tasks for step two. Plus they are taking on the risk delivering that food to you. If your order is correct then are satisfied and happy. Just as an architect you are providing people a skilled service. If people like your work then obviously they are satisfied and happy as well. You work in a skilled career and occupation. And so do the people who work at Papa John's. That's just where me and some people differ. I see people as equals.

I haven't seen people make any distinction about a person's worth because of a job they have. Just that the jobs have different levels of required education.

The difference between skilled and unskilled is the architect could get a pizza job if he wanted. The Papa John's employee would need to go to school to be an architect first.

 

[LouderVol]

I haven't seen people make any distinction about a person's worth because of a job they have. Just that the jobs have different levels of required education.

The difference between skilled and unskilled is the architect could get a pizza job if he wanted. The Papa John's employee would need to go to school to be an architect first.

An accredited program with it's own higher admission rates, get a masters or equivalent 5 years minimum, work for at least 2.5 years in the field, pass at least 6 tests, then get approved by whatever state government. Then you are also bound by several state laws for conduct that extend beyond the work place, get to pay special tax rates, renew accreditation every two years max with some minimum of continuing ed, belong to at least two professional groups with their own standards and qualifications.

But yeah that papa John's gig is just as specialized as my job.

 

[NEO]

Lower pay in these fields leads to lower quality of applicants and higher turnover within the first five years. Why do we have so many ****** cops and teachers? Because we're only paying enough to attract ****** cops and teachers.

This is where I answer quizzes like the ones we all took here and it drags my ass over to the left which it honestly shouldn’t.

I view this country like a corporation and teachers are the R&D side. Your corporation can only grow if your R&D is strong. Otherwise, your business becomes stagnant and you fall by the waste side.

The standard should be much higher and the pay should match for both police and teachers. It should also be a year round job for teachers who keep working in the summer. The students who did not earn atleast a B or an A in the class would be required to go to school in the summer to strengthen their understanding of the course. This gives kids a reason to get better grades who are lazy but want their summer free and also helps kids on the line who need more time.

I am gonna be brutally honest here. 9 times out of 10 someone tells me they are a teacher (K-12) I automatically assume they bring very little value to the table and couldn’t hack it in the real world.

This should be the exact opposite.

 

[DonjoVol]

An accredited program with it's own higher admission rates, get a masters or equivalent 5 years minimum, work for at least 2.5 years in the field, pass at least 6 tests, then get approved by whatever state government. Then you are also bound by several state laws for conduct that extend beyond the work place, get to pay special tax rates, renew accreditation every two years max with some minimum of continuing ed, belong to at least two professional groups with their own standards and qualifications.

But yeah that papa John's gig is just as specialized as my job.

You expect them to provide you a service. Therfore it is a skilled job.

Those managers also have to have certifications now such as ServSafe. Health department standards have to be followed as well as the standards set forth by Papa John's. That driver is also putting themselves at risk delivering food that you paid for that you did not have to make. Plus for all we know that delivery driver could be working there part time to pay for that bachelor's degree he or she completed.

At this point it's not my fault that you look down on working class people now.

 

[NEO]

You expect them to provide you a service. Therfore it is a skilled job.

Those managers also have to have certifications now such as ServSafe. Health department standards have to be followed as well as the standards set forth by Papa John's. That driver is also putting themselves at risk delivering food that you paid for that you did not have to make. Plus for all we know that delivery driver could be working there part time to pay for that bachelor's degree he or she completed.


At this point it's not my fault that you look down on working class people now.

Hard work and skilled work aren’t the same.

 

[LouderVol]

You expect them to provide you a service. Therfore it is a skilled job.

Those managers also have to have certifications now such as ServSafe. Health department standards have to be followed as well as the standards set forth by Papa John's. That driver is also putting themselves at risk delivering food that you paid for that you did not have to make. Plus for all we know that delivery driver could be working there part time to pay for that bachelor's degree he or she completed.

At this point it's not my fault that you look down on working class people now.

Look down on them? I dont, and have been very careful in my wording that you ignore. I specified the job. I did hotel breakfast and landscaping working 5 to 9 most summers to get where I am. Because I knew the JOB(s) I had wasnt good enough, it's not what I wanted. I wanted a better JOB. I have not once even hinted that the PERSON working any other job is less than me. I even went out of my way to criticize many of the PEOPLE I share a JOB with, while talking up PEOPLE with a different JOB.

My office has an entire library of codes and laws we have to keep up with. So much so that we have taken it digital. Including the health code you bring up. Then there are the industry standards, environmental concerns, other accreditations the client may want.

 

[DonjoVol]

Hard work and skilled work aren’t the same.

It's definitely skilled work. How many people are you responsible for feeding each year? Guarantee you a Papa John's location is responsible for thousands per year. And how many times a year do you pay for a restaurant to feed you?

Like I said it's definitely skilled work.

 

[LouderVol]

Hard work and skilled work aren’t the same.

At least he is off how popular the job is.

 

[DonjoVol]

Look down on them? I dont, and have been very careful in my wording that you ignore. I specified the job. I did hotel breakfast and landscaping working 5 to 9 most summers to get where I am. Because I knew the JOB(s) I had wasnt good enough, it's not what I wanted. I wanted a better JOB. I have not once even hinted that the PERSON working any other job is less than me. I even went out of my way to criticize many of the PEOPLE I share a JOB with, while talking up PEOPLE with a different JOB.

My office has an entire library of codes and laws we have to keep up with. So much so that we have taken it digital. Including the health code you bring up. Then there are the industry standards, environmental concerns, other accreditations the client may want.

Okay if you worked those types of jobs when you were younger then you should realize they are skilled jobs. It seems to me your are putting an emphasis on skilled jobs requiring an education. Simply not the point.

You think the managers at a restaurant aren't required to follow laws or have specialized training? Many full service restaurants require managers to have bachelor's degree. And for all we know that server or cook is working to become an architect.

 

[DonjoVol]

At least he is off how popular the job is.

Popular??