Oregon counties/Join Idaho vote

[LouderVol]

Sham referenda?

Why? Were the local Oreganian officials ran out of town? Did Idahoan men with guns conduct the election? Were these areas able to identify exactly what territory it would effect?

 

[RatchedVol]

Didn't Scott County do it too? Rescinded their seccession ordinance in the 1980s?

Yes. “Became” the Free and Independent State of Scott

 

[rekinhavoc]

Democrat-led state that’s ‘killing businesses’ could shrink amid push to secede in several counties

Up to 11 counties.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

Democrat-led state that’s ‘killing businesses’ could shrink amid push to secede in several counties

Up to 11 counties.

This is neither legal or justifiable. The borders of Oregon need to be maintained.

 

[GroverCleveland]

This is neither legal or justifiable. The borders of Oregon need to be maintained.

West Virginia says "Hi!"

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

West Virginia says "Hi!"

Whataboutism???

 

[NorthDallas40]

This is neither legal or justifiable. The borders of Oregon need to be maintained.

*wanders over to the Ukraine thread and sees your body of work justifying Putin’s land grab there*

 

[GroverCleveland]

Whataboutism???

Hardly. Direct relationship to counties of a state not liking the way the rest of state was headed politically and successfully seceded from said state without the approval of said state and acquiescence, nay the active encouragement, of a rump Congress.

Unless I misunderstood your post, you stated that was illegal and unjustifiable. Of course, you may have meant only when you disagree with the reasons those counties may want to secede.

 

[NEO]

West Virginia says "Hi!"

I honestly don’t know the legalities of this in 2023 vs then. I wonder if there have been stop gaps put in place to stop this from happening again.

But this is exactly what WV did so now I’m curious.

 

[hog88]

I honestly don’t know the legalities of this in 2023 vs then. I wonder if there have been stop gaps put in place to stop this from happening again.

But this is exactly what WV did so now I’m curious.

The formation of WVA was without question unconstitutional. The vote to form a separate state was much like teh vote in Crimea to join Russia, supervised at the end of a gun barrel.

 

[GroverCleveland]

I honestly don’t know the legalities of this in 2023 vs then. I wonder if there have been stop gaps put in place to stop this from happening again.

But this is exactly what WV did so now I’m curious.

Yeah, was reading about it and found that Maine pretty much did the same thing with those counties voting to secede from Massachusettes, although Maine's admittance to the Union was part of the Missouri Compromise.

 

[hog88]

Yeah, was reading about it and found that Maine pretty much did the same thing with those counties voting to secede from Massachusettes, although Maine's admittance to the Union was part of the Missouri Compromise.

And MA consented.

 

[rekinhavoc]

Rural Oregon movement to join 'Greater Idaho' gains traction with vote in 12th county

 

[WBO]

What a waste of time and effort. Georgia had a better chance trying to move the SE border of Tennessee. At least their argument was "drunk surveyors screwed it up." Here it's, "we don't like being in the political minority."

 

[clarksvol00]

What a waste of time and effort. Georgia had a better chance trying to move the SE border of Tennessee. At least their argument was "drunk surveyors screwed it up." Here it's, "we don't like being in the political minority."

"We want a national divorce! People in big cities shouldn't get to out vote me!"

 

[hog88]

"We want a national divorce! People in big cities shouldn't get to out vote me!"

So you oppose people in eastern OR deciding they fit better with ID than Portland?

 

[clarksvol00]

So you oppose people in eastern OR deciding they fit better with ID than Portland?

Yes.

Edit: let me clarify that. They can decide whatever they want. I oppose them being able to secede from the state.

 

[McDad]

So you oppose people in eastern OR deciding they fit better with ID than Portland?

Of course.
But let the electoral college elect an R over a D as president and "It'S tImE tO eLeCt A pReSiDeNt By PoPuLaR vOtE"!

 

[LouderVol]

Yes.

Edit: let me clarify that. They can decide whatever they want. I oppose them being able to secede from the state.

Why?

Seems like it's a majority vote in those areas. Why wouldnt we at least entertain them changing their status?

Seems like a similar situation to DC.

 

[clarksvol00]

Why?

Seems like it's a majority vote in those areas. Why wouldnt we at least entertain them changing their status?

Seems like a similar situation to DC.

Well, for one thing it would screw with tHe EleCTorAl CoLlege, and we don't want @McDad to get upset.

 

[LouderVol]

Well, for one thing it would screw with tHe EleCTorAl CoLlege, and we don't want @McDad to get upset.

No more than any other population change would.

And I havent checked the math, but since idaho is such a low population state it may help with that 1 electoral vote representing more people in one state than it does in another issue.

 

[McDad]

Well, for one thing it would screw with tHe EleCTorAl CoLlege, and we don't want @McDad to get upset.

It would possibly alter the population thus changing the number of representatives from each state. That happens now with population shifts between states over time. Seems the Republic weathered the crisis.

Any other objections?

 

[clarksvol00]

No more than any other population change would.

And I havent checked the math, but since idaho is such a low population state it may help with that 1 electoral vote representing more people in one state than it does in another issue.

I'm just trying to look out for the sanctum sanctorum for @McDad

Honestly, I think it's ludicrous to start redrawing state lines because some people who voluntarily live in a state don't get there way. What happens when people in the middle of a state dont get their way? Do they become their own state? Do they get to pick any other state they want?

 

[clarksvol00]

It would possibly alter the population thus changing the number of representatives from each state. That happens now with population shifts between states over time. Seems the Republic weathered the crisis.

Any other objections?

Same objection stands. Every time we lose an election, let's redraw a state line to change some votes.

 

[LouderVol]

I'm just trying to look out for the sanctum sanctorum for @McDad

Honestly, I think it's ludicrous to start redrawing state lines because some people who voluntarily live in a state don't get there way. What happens when people in the middle of a state dont get their way? Do they become their own state? Do they get to pick any other state they want?

I think you are over simplifying the issue. My understanding is that these people have some legitimate issues that arent being addressed. Infrastructure, school funding, etc, things that shouldnt be left vs right issues, but because they dont vote with the majority they dont have representation to see that their issues get better.

It's part of the fallacy of our flavor of democracy/republic. Winner takes all.

At some point it does start to look like taxation without representation if they are being ignored by the state they pay taxes to.

I havent dug in to actually see if the claims they are making are true regarding funding and some of their past complaints. But this goes far beyond them not wanting to be in the same state as the liberals in Portland.