Pelosi visit to Taiwan

#76
#76
EasternVol said:
The military can handle it.
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Oh really. OK.

EasternVol said:
If Biden and his crew back down now it will make it that much harder for the next administration to gain leverage.
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As long as we have nukes, that should be all the leverage we need. The motivation should be to employ diplomatic measures, not these provocative "I dare you" stunts in an attempt to dismiss China.

EasternVol said:
PRC knows they will lose a war against us.
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Best case scenario, what would a US victory look like? Do you think the Chinese (or Russians) would just laydown and not launch one if they seem themselves losing? It would be a Hail Mary.

EasternVol said:
They are trying to manouvre us to a point we cannot fight them and win.
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If you clowns and neocons would stop provoking things, Taiwan and China will likely peacefully resolve this in 30 or so years and this becomes a moot point. They are going to reunify.

EasternVol said:
And you are cheering for that.
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I'm not cheering on jack squat. I'm telling you guys to exercise a bit of discretion and really think about if this trip to Taiwan is actually worth starting a war over.
 
#77
#77
VolStrom said:
I actually think this is the perfect time to stir the pot with China. We need to decouple our economy from theirs, and we apparently are so drunk on reclaiming some of our money, we don't know how. Having them shoot at Pelosi's plane would evict them from our economy in short order.
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Hey genius, we need to build our new house before we burn down the old one. We don't have anything right now to fall back or monkey branch to if we stir things up right now. And the present leadership in America is 110% on board with de-industrializing and going to green energy. So that is a double whammy. It would be a reckless and stupid move to do anything of the sort.

Also, we don't have to be enemies with China or anyone. They will still be a need for products or commodities coming from China even if we did de-couple.
 
#78
#78
Rasputin_Vol said:
There is nothing funny or humorous about this situation. It doesn't matter if China only has one nuke in their possession. That is all it will take to wipe out humanity.


No, this is a loss of face for Pelosi and the Biden Administration. It is quite clear that these clowns are corrupt and incompetent.


I would say likely not. I would give it 99% odds not. But why even risk that 1%? Over Pelosi? Really?
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I agree with your second paragraph. This is not about Pelosi. This is about a thug dictating where or diplomats may or may not go. What should have happened is that Pelosi shouldn't have been advertising this, and just showed up. But now it's out in the open. Gotta go. If we don't, what will the bully tell us we can't do next?
 
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#79
#79
Rasputin_Vol said:
Hey genius, we need to build our new house before we burn down the old one. We don't have anything right now to fall back or monkey branch to if we stir things up right now. And the present leadership in America is 110% on board with de-industrializing and going to green energy. So that is a double whammy. It would be a reckless and stupid move to do anything of the sort.

Also, we don't have to be enemies with China or anyone. They will still be a need for products or commodities coming from China even if we did de-couple.
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That's what Trump was doing with the tariffs... Getting us off the Chinese teat. And it was starting to work. But now that Puddinhead is 'in charge', things are back to normal and everybody is walking all over us once again.
 
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#80
#80
SpaceCoastVol said:
I agree with your second paragraph. This is not about Pelosi. This is about a thug dictating where or diplomats may or may not go. What should have happened is that Pelosi shouldn't have been advertising this, and just showed up. But now it's out in the open. Gotta go. If we don't, what will the bully tell us we can't do next?
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Don't know what could be next. Deal with it when the time comes. But gambling on China just keeping their hands in their pocket is not worth it in this particular situation. This really isn't worth it. And we don't have the competent people in place to properly handle a China reaction anyways.
 
#81
#81
Rasputin_Vol said:
Oh really. OK.


As long as we have nukes, that should be all the leverage we need. The motivation should be to employ diplomatic measures, not these provocative "I dare you" stunts in an attempt to dismiss China.


Best case scenario, what would a US victory look like? Do you think the Chinese (or Russians) would just laydown and not launch one if they seem themselves losing? It would be a Hail Mary.


If you clowns and neocons would stop provoking things, Taiwan and China will likely peacefully resolve this in 30 or so years and this becomes a moot point. They are going to reunify.

I'm not cheering on jack squat. I'm telling you guys to exercise a bit of discretion and really think about if this trip to Taiwan is actually worth starting a war over.
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We've had nukes since Mao got control of the mainland. And that didn't stop the PRC from making the South China Sea a PRC navy base, taking territory from Vietnam, Philippines, etc., claiming their neighbors' fishing rights, colonizing Tibet and Xinjiang, and on and on. Because we and other powers appeased them.
Appeasement of PRC means empowerment of PRC. Empowerment of PRC means woe to the rest of the world.
Did you hear the old one about Adoph and Neville? Or Hirohito and the West? The remakes are being written now.
You say appease, which means empowering PRC. Not maintaining even status quo but strengthening a brutal dictatorship. And before you say it, yes they are far worse than us.
You say don't antagonize them. The only way to not antagonize them is to give them everything. You do see the end result of playing their game don't you?
 
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#82
#82
Rasputin_Vol said:
Hey genius, we need to build our new house before we burn down the old one. We don't have anything right now to fall back or monkey branch to if we stir things up right now. And the present leadership in America is 110% on board with de-industrializing and going to green energy. So that is a double whammy. It would be a reckless and stupid move to do anything of the sort.

Also, we don't have to be enemies with China or anyone. They will still be a need for products or commodities coming from China even if we did de-couple.
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Okay. I understand we need to start making our own crap again and will probably start making it in south america or other parts of se asia. I guess you and your generation are F'd if you can't figure it out.
 
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#83
#83
SpaceCoastVol said:
That's what Trump was doing with the tariffs... Getting us off the Chinese teat. And it was starting to work. But now that Puddinhead is 'in charge', things are back to normal and everybody is walking all over us once again.
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I'm not disagreeing with that to an extent. But this is not going to be a quick process. To say it will take a decade to turn this around here in America is being optimistic. We've got to re-instill work ethic, bring back these skills and trades and have some restoration in family and community cohesion before we need to start picking fights with nuclear peers.
 
#84
#84
China doesn’t need a military response. They could easily be crushed by denying their participation in the global economy with easily implemented sanctions. Their economy is completely dependent on cooperation with the western powers - especially the US. The downside is far less cheap crap for sale at Walmart and DollarTree and the humanitarian crisis of hundreds of millions of Chinese starving. Unfortunately the CCP has little respect (or fear) of the Biden administration or the current Congress. Nancy needs to go forward with a visit to Taiwan. Unfortunately her loyalty lies with the DNC and a failing globalist agenda. She might could bail out of the visit.
 
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#85
#85
Rasputin_Vol said:
I'm not disagreeing with that to an extent. But this is not going to be a quick process. To say it will take a decade to turn this around here in America is being optimistic. We've got to re-instill work ethic, bring back these skills and trades and have some restoration in family and community cohesion before we need to start picking fights with nuclear peers.
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Can't even start until we get rid of the vermin currently holding all the houses of .gov
 
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#86
#86
Thunder Good-Oil said:
China doesn’t need a military response. They could easily be crushed by denying their participation in the global economy with easily implemented sanctions. Their economy is completely dependent on cooperation with the western powers - especially the US. The downside is far less cheap crap for sale at Walmart and DollarTree and the humanitarian crisis of hundreds of millions of Chinese starving. Unfortunately the CCP has little respect (or fear) of the Biden administration or the current Congress. Nancy needs to go forward with a visit to Taiwan. Unfortunately her loyalty lies with the DNC and a failing globalist agenda. She might could bail out of the visit.
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It's a bigger disaster if she punts
 
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#87
#87
VolStrom said:
Okay. I understand we need to start making our own crap again and will probably start making it in south america or other parts of se asia. I guess you and your generation are F'd if you can't figure it out.
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We just need to get these damn Boomers out of the way that hold all of these Cold War grudges and think we are still able to push countries around like we did in the good ole days. Diplomacy, American re-industrialization and restoration of some moral norms is the only way we make it back.
 
#88
#88
Thunder Good-Oil said:
China doesn’t need a military response. They could easily be crushed by denying their participation in the global economy with easily implemented sanctions. Their economy is completely dependent on cooperation with the western powers - especially the US. The downside is far less cheap crap for sale at Walmart and DollarTree and the humanitarian crisis of hundreds of millions of Chinese starving. Unfortunately the CCP has little respect (or fear) of the Biden administration or the current Congress. Nancy needs to go forward with a visit to Taiwan. Unfortunately her loyalty lies with the DNC and a failing globalist agenda. She might could bail out of the visit.
Click to expand...
Sanctions? Really? You still on this? If we sanction China, you really think that is going to hurt China more than us at this moment in 2022? Who else is going to cooperate with these sanctions? Western Europe? Australia? Maybe Japan?

They will be fine.
 
#89
#89
Rasputin_Vol said:
We just need to get these damn Boomers out of the way that hold all of these Cold War grudges and think we are still able to push countries around like we did in the good ole days. Diplomacy, American re-industrialization and restoration of some moral norms is the only way we make it back.
Click to expand...

Instead of being a strong world economic and military leader, maybe we can write more poems promoting world harmony.
 
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#90
#90
Thunder Good-Oil said:
China doesn’t need a military response. They could easily be crushed by denying their participation in the global economy with easily implemented sanctions. Their economy is completely dependent on cooperation with the western powers - especially the US. The downside is far less cheap crap for sale at Walmart and DollarTree and the humanitarian crisis of hundreds of millions of Chinese starving. Unfortunately the CCP has little respect (or fear) of the Biden administration or the current Congress. Nancy needs to go forward with a visit to Taiwan. Unfortunately her loyalty lies with the DNC and a failing globalist agenda. She might could bail out of the visit.
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Cheap crap? No silly... try a bunch of crap. How much of what we need right now is made in China vs here at home? You think shortages are bad now, just wait until we cut out the world's largest exporter from our economy.
 
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#92
#92
Rasputin_Vol said:
Sanctions? Really? You still on this? If we sanction China, you really think that is going to hurt China more than us at this moment in 2022? Who else is going to cooperate with these sanctions? Western Europe? Australia? Maybe Japan?

They will be fine.
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I didn’t say sanction China directly. But that is easy to do. Sanctioning those that enable them is very much in the tool box.
 
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#96
#96
VolStrom said:
I actually think this is the perfect time to stir the pot with China. We need to decouple our economy from theirs, and we apparently are so drunk on reclaiming some of our money, we don't know how. Having them shoot at Pelosi's plane would evict them from our economy in short order.
Click to expand...
I wouldn't want to lose the air crew. But they won't attack the plane.
 
#97
#97
Rasputin_Vol said:
Cheap crap? No silly... try a bunch of crap. How much of what we need right now is made in China vs here at home? You think shortages are bad now, just wait until we cut out the world's largest exporter from our economy.
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There are many other nations willing to take up the slack, Comrade.

Shortages aren’t nearly as bad as it’s being framed and promoted. We have plenty of toilet paper. Babies aren’t dying off because we’re out of formula. Hospitals haven’t been closed due to a lack of PPE. The shortages have been due to panic on the demand side. The supply side adjusts.
 
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#99
#99
Thunder Good-Oil said:
There are many other nations willing to take up the slack, Comrade.
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You think they will be able to just ramp up making widgets overnight? Even if they are making things right now, they will have to scale up to meet US demand.

And even then, that isn't the answer because now instead of China, we are relying on another foreign country.
 
#100
#100
Rasputin_Vol said:
How many more countries are we going to sanction?
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I wouldn’t consider using free access to US consumers as necessarily sanctions. More like negotiating.

I wouldn’t consider guaranteeing safe passage of shipping lanes between the ME and China a sanction.

The US and our allies can take our ball and go home at anytime if China ramps it up.
 
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