Peyton Manning's faith

[oregonvol]

If God is omnipotent he can save good people from going to hell, even if they don't accept Christ in this life. If I go the wrong way in a burning building cause I was confused and you can still save me, would you save me or would you say, "Nah, he didn't choose the path I wanted him to go. I'll let him die." It's not your fault, but it's not the behavior of a loving, all-powerful Father.

Doesn't make sense to me.

It's called "free will". In your conception, you would want an omnipotent god to overrule your own choices, thus eliminating your free will. Is that really your ideal?

 

[n_huffhines]

It's called "free will". In your conception, you would want an omnipotent god to overrule your own choices, thus eliminating your free will. Is that really your ideal?

We're not talking about the same thing. At all.

 

[BenGrimm]

If God is omnipotent he can save good people from going to hell, even if they don't accept Christ in this life. If I go the wrong way in a burning building cause I was confused and you can still save me, would you save me or would you say, "Nah, he didn't choose the path I wanted him to go. I'll let him die." It's not your fault, but it's not the behavior of a loving, all-powerful Father.

Doesn't make sense to me.

He is a loving God but he is also a jealous and vengeful God.

It's never made sense me either.

 

[SDV]

What are cuss words? I think they're culturally defined. Which isn't saying much beyond them being voted as such without a formal voting process. Consequently, cuss words are cuss words depending on the whim of a culture. To me personally, cuss words are lewd terms used explicitly to denigrate or humiliate someone. But you know how it is, people who demand to be so self-righteous they dictate what you say and even how you say it. which funny. Micturition and urination are both thought to be polite while piss is what both terms mean is considered lewd and impolite.

And actually, Peyton didn't use God's name in vain. The capitalized form of god, is a westernized creation and isn't God's name. It's supposed to denote that this god is the one true God. But it's not His actual name. His name is YhWh, pronounced Yeh Weh, though the Hebrew language has no vowels, I'm told. Peyton didn't use this utterance so didn't technically use God's name in vain.

.

 

[tennesseeduke]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DttfyOeU3vw[/youtube]

Get the plank out of your your eye! Oh and please never post here again!

Peyton is outstanding and is the greatest ambassador of College and the NFL in history. Based on the article, now we know why!

:spank:

Tennesseeduke

 

[GVF]

A Christian should be known by his actions not his words. All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of god. Do not let your left hand know what your right is doing. All new testament teachings Peyton is emphasizing. All important to trying to live the way a Christian is supposed to.
Posted via VolNation Mobile

 

[jp1]

I can agree with this but when I tell that person I don't want to hear it, why won't they just shut up?

I guess because that person cares enough about you make sure you fully understand.

It would be the same as if someone were about to jump off a bridge, and you tried to talk them out of what they are doing. Would you just give up if they looked at you and said " I dont want to hear it"?

 

[VolFan4Life87]

I would disagree my friend. I imagine Tebow impressed many non believers as well. As far as converting the masses, why should there be no discipleship today? I would think sharing one's faith would go a long way toward making the world a better place.

It really just annoys non-believers.

 

[VolFan4Life87]

I typically don't comment on religious things around here. Before my wife and I got divorced however, I was a preacher.

Here's my 2 cents, for anyone who cares:

I appreciate those who are vocal about their faith to an extent. I don't appreciate the rapper who thanks God when he wins an award for his song that contains filthy language and inappropriate themes.

But I do appreciate someone who seems to try to live it out in their life talking about it. I appreciate Tim Tebow, despite what others may say about him. He has yet to give me a reason to think he is hypocritical in his life. And I definitely appreciated reading this about Peyton.

But to those who are saying, "I appreciate the guy keeping it private," I actually don't. Not that he's wrong for it, I'm sure he's displayed his faith in many ways to many people we don't know about. However, Jesus says you are the light of the world, and don't put it under a basket, but display it. I think that if the world doesn't know you're a Christian, just a good moral person, you're not doing your job. Jesus said "Woe to you when all men speak well of you." If you're pleasing everyone because you're not stepping out there, then you're not doing what you should. If you're living as a Christian, you're going to offend people.

Many people say "It's that they try to force it on people." I don't see how a Christian making a statement about their faith is any more "forcing" than you turning on the tv and being bombarded with advertisement. It's someone telling you they have something they think is great, and you should have it too. But if you don't want it, hey, at least you knew.

Oh, and you said, "The world would be a better place if everyone just minded their business?"

If I saw a car coming at you, and you didn't see or hear it, and I just minded my own business, would the world be a better place then?

Understand, most Christians (won't go with all), but most Christians, if they say anything at all about Jesus, it's most likely coming from a true belief in Heaven or Hell. And if you don't have that, okay. But understand that if a person says anything to you about it, to them its the equivalent of at least trying to push you out of the way of what could be a terrible eternity. How could you hate on that? That someone loved you enough to try to push you out of the way of something they believed to be real?

I know some Christians are abrasive, legalistic, annoying at times, and highly hypocritical. We've all met them. But if you ever meet a TRUE Christian, who is trying to walk in the footsteps of the man named Jesus and be like him, I guarantee you, you don't come away from that person despising Christianity, or being pushed further away.

Just my 2 cents. Carry on Volnation.

People hate advertisements too. Junk mail comes to mind as well.

 

[jp1]

It really just annoys non-believers.

Serious question....why?

 

[VolFan4Life87]

People like me? Not a single word from me accompanied that video. You know nothing about me or my intentions.

This. I'm glad you shared the video, I didn't take it as a "look he's a hypocrite" post but more-so making a funny. I think that video is hilarious and humorously-relevant to this topic.

 

[n_huffhines]

Serious question....why?

Tebow? Think about if every time Tebow got the mic he started talking about remote control planes (if that were his passion) and you don't care about RC planes. It'd get old fast.

Also, the idea that God picks winners and losers, or blesses certain individuals to win is just silly. Durant said, "we have God on our side." last night. Well apparently Durant thinks God can't win an NBA championship. It makes no sense.

 

[n_huffhines]

This. I'm glad you shared the video, I didn't take it as a "look he's a hypocrite" post but more-so making a funny. I think that video is hilarious and humorously-relevant to this topic.

Yeah, it seems the believers are judging the implications of the video harshly and then criticizing non-believers for judging him on it. I don't see Peyton as a hypocrite, I just see the video as well-timed joke.

 

[VolFan4Life87]

Serious question....why?

You're selling something the non believer doesn't want to buy, and you're using fear of the unknown to spread it.

Here's a better question; IF (huge hypothetical if) upon death non-believers weren't sentenced to hell and eternal damnation, but instead just went somewhere else not as perfect as heaven but not one full of torment - how many people would bother with Christianity? This is honestly, in my opinion, the reason why it rubs some people and will always rub some people the wrong way. They're being told if they don't do something, they will suffer eternal wrath.

When I say you I of course do not mean you personally. :hi: My very best friend is devoutly atheist and we've had many detailed discussions on these topics. I tend to play advocate for either side from time to time simply for objectivity.

 

[Other_Guy]

I just don't see how someone who found a different "path" to their own peace and understanding other than Christianity should be doomed to burn in a lake of fire for ever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever. How do the sins of one lifetime = an eternity of arduous torment, pain, and suffering? Has anyone not stopped to consider just how overly excessive that sounds and how completely illogical it is? Christians love to say "God doesn't send people hell, people put themselves there." Well if you take what the Bible says at face value that is a load of crap! The Bible says people will be "cast" into the lake of fire. That sure sounds like being put in there against their will to me.

The way I see it, if God truly exists and he is a loving God, there should be no exclusivity as to who will and will not get into Heaven, regardless of what they did or didn't do on Earth. Humanity needs to be looked at differently in that good and evil exists in all of us. No one makes all the "right" choices during our time here on Earth. Some make horrible HORRIBLE choices. Some live peaceful. Some do terrible and heinous acts. Some are more "righteous" than others. However if you take what the Bible says as fact in that in God's eyes all sin is equal every single one of us are sinners and aren't worthy of Heaven. If that is true that means we are all already born screwed! But the way I see it, that also means we should all also be equally deserving! We didn't ask to be born! We didn't ask to be part of a lineage that started with the sins of 2 people. IMO, if you believe in the teachings of the Bible the only 2 people that should truly be judged is Adam and Eve because they were the ones that brought sin into the world in the first place. We didn't! We were simply born into it and I don't think we should be held to the same level of accountability. According to the Bible, God sent Jesus to die on the cross to pay for our sins. Great! To me, that should mean for ALL people, whether they are wise enough to accept it or not. The power and potency of that act should be as such to where all humanity is saved regardless of what they do or don't do while on earth.

You are missing the simplicity of it. It has nothing to do with how "good" you are. Its not "wise enough" to accept it. We all deserve hell because we choose to sin. We are held just as accountable because every single person who ever lived chose to sin and will continue to no matter how well they try. Its such a simple, easy way out of eternal death. People can't accept that its too simple and that we are supposed to do something on our own. Fact is we can't do anything. God offers a way out. No one has to worry about hell and the punishment if they would just accept him into their hearts

 

[VolFan4Life87]

You are missing the simplicity of it. It has nothing to do with how "good" you are. Its not "wise enough" to accept it. We all deserve hell because we choose to sin. We are held just as accountable because every single person who ever lived chose to sin and will continue to no matter how well they try. Its such a simple, easy way out of eternal death. People can't accept that its too simple and that we are supposed to do something on our own. Fact is we can't do anything. God offers a way out. No one has to worry about hell and the punishment if they would just accept him into their hearts

Accept something you cannot see, feel, taste, touch, hear, etc. Something no one can definitively prove exists (don't start with the "you can't prove he doesn't exist" - burden of proof is on the guy who claims he saw bigfoot). That is not simple at all to many folks in the world, especially in a society that has rapidly advanced technologically.

 

[MikeVol44]

Really! Before anyone goes and criticizes Peyton for cussing they should check out the Billy Graham/Nixon tapes. Billy Graham is easily recognized as one of the most important and influential Christian evangelists in the modern era, and the guy absolutely cusses like a drunken sailor! lol:

Sorry--but I think you have the voices mixed up---It's Nixon who is cursing on those tapes and not Graham....

Those tapes have been publicly available for YEARS--and the press would have had jumped Billy's case much sooner than now if what you are saying is true.

I must confess that I've never listened to the tapes--but I have NEVER read anywhere at anytime anyone else who HAS LISTENED to them attribute the cursing on them to the Rev. Billy Graham--who without doubt has lived a life above reproach. eace2:

 

[MikeVol44]

Accept something you cannot see, feel, taste, touch, hear, etc. Something no one can definitively prove exists (don't start with the "you can't prove he doesn't exist" - burden of proof is on the guy who claims he saw bigfoot). That is not simple at all to many folks in the world, especially in a society that has rapidly advanced technologically.

Have you ever seen, felt, tasted, touched, heard your own brain?

However, the premise of your argument is sound--that's why we consider the evidence.

The God of the Bible has never once attempted to PROVE that He exists--but the Bible does claim that He did come to earth in the likeness of man--as the historical Person known as Jesus of Nazareth. There's PLENTY of evidence to demonstrate that this is true. :hi:

 

[Other_Guy]

If God is omnipotent he can save good people from going to hell, even if they don't accept Christ in this life. If I go the wrong way in a burning building cause I was confused and you can still save me, would you save me or would you say, "Nah, he didn't choose the path I wanted him to go. I'll let him die." It's not your fault, but it's not the behavior of a loving, all-powerful Father.

Doesn't make sense to me.

You're just complicating things lol. If there is another way, why would he send His Son in the 1st place?
And there is no other path. 1 simple path. Its not complicated or hard for us as humans. God makes it very clear to us. If we choose to go our own path... that's our own choice. We don't want to be robots, we want there to be choice. Well, God gives us the choice. Its up to us whether we heed his word or ignore it.

 

[Brave Volunteer]

You are missing the simplicity of it. It has nothing to do with how "good" you are. Its not "wise enough" to accept it. We all deserve hell because we choose to sin. We are held just as accountable because every single person who ever lived chose to sin and will continue to no matter how well they try. Its such a simple, easy way out of eternal death. People can't accept that its too simple and that we are supposed to do something on our own. Fact is we can't do anything. God offers a way out. No one has to worry about hell and the punishment if they would just accept him into their hearts

We don't "choose" to sin. We DO sin because we are born TO sin. By one man's disobedience, sin entered into the world, isn't that what the Bible says? We were all pre-destined to be sinners the minute Adam and Eve took a bite of the apple (if you believe that story). No matter how hard any of us try, no one goes through life sinless. It's an impossible feat. Whether someone sins by being prideful or selfish or someone sins by being a murderer or rapist, according to the Bible it's all the same in God's eyes. I guess you could say some do a better job of suppressing it than others. But regardless, we are ALL in the same boat! Like I said, every person born after Adam and Eve are screwed because of what THEY did. None of us were born in the Garden of Eden where we had the advantage of actually walking and talking with God in a literal, physical sense and know Him without having to take it on faith like they did. Yet despite that they STILL disobeyed God. How in reality can we be expected to be any different?

 

[K-town Vol Fan]

Have you ever seen, felt, tasted, touched, heard your own brain?

We know we have brains because you can crack the skull open and see it. In everyone.


Bad example.

 

[Other_Guy]

Accept something you cannot see, feel, taste, touch, hear, etc. Something no one can definitively prove exists (don't start with the "you can't prove he doesn't exist" - burden of proof is on the guy who claims he saw bigfoot). That is not simple at all to many folks in the world, especially in a society that has rapidly advanced technologically.

Same goes for the wind.

I look at creation and can see a Creator. I felt Him tug at my heart telling me I was a sinner and that He loved me. I hear Him speak to me now that I have been saved. And I have tasted His blessings and love for me.

God wants you to have faith in Him. That's the whole basis of Christianity. We see what we want to see and not what we don't want to see.

 

[MikeVol44]

"My faith doesn't make me perfect, it makes me forgiven." Peyton Manning

I certainly like Peyton's quote here as it really explains the importance of Grace. However, this video is not an isolated one of Peyton's cursing...

I personally will not cast stones at him, but--I find it interesting that there are SO many on here who will quickly defend Peyton and continually MOCK and CRITICIZE Tim Tebow...another devout Christian who attempts to live his life above reproach and in honor of the LORD Jesus.

I admire both men--for their abilities (which I could only dream about) and for their CLASS.

I would think that Peyton would be embarrassed by his cursing--and would seek the LORD's forgiveness for using His Name in vain...

Nevertheless--that's why Salvation is received as an act of Faith--so that it may be in accordance with God's Grace and not earned by the "goodness" of men...

Finally--I find the video humbling, as I am embarrassed by some of my posts on here when I go back and read them later. Please forgive me for my offenses....:hi:

 

[utvolpj]

so the video makes you a humbled "Professional Dope Dealer"?

 

[Other_Guy]

We don't "choose" to sin. We DO sin because we are born TO sin. By one man's disobedience, sin entered into the world, isn't that what the Bible says? We were all pre-destined to be sinners the minute Adam and Eve took a bite of the apple (if you believe that story). No matter how hard any of us try, no one goes through life sinless. It's an impossible feat. Whether someone sins by being prideful or selfish or someone sins by being a murderer or rapist, according to the Bible it's all the same in God's eyes. I guess you could say some do a better job of suppressing it than others. But regardless, we are ALL in the same boat! Like I said, every person born after Adam and Eve are screwed because of what THEY did. None of us were born in the Garden of Eden where we had the advantage of actually walking and talking with God in a literal, physical sense and know Him without having to take it on faith like they did. Yet despite that they STILL disobeyed God. How in reality can we be expected to be any different?

Where do you get we were predestined? We CHOOSE to sin. Everytime I sin its my own choice. The devil doesn't even make me. Its all me.
Other than that 1st part the rest is true. But you're making my point! We are all in the samme boat. We were screwed. God is providing a way out. So its not all for not. We just have to accept His Son and be forgiven. Its that simple!