Putin Wants To Debate Biden

#226
#226
hog88 said:
The capital protesters/rioters weren’t trying to install a different government.
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BigOrangeTrain said:
They weren’t mainly peaceful. They were mainly violent. While the capital was violent, it was a one off event. There is literally no comparison to be made.
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BigOrangeTrain said:
The capital riots were committed by extremists Q followers. They deserve whatever punishment they get. They weren’t saints. Nor was it an insurrection.
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Capitol, with an O.

BigOrangeTrain said:
Wow. You really have embarrassed yourself in this thread good job.
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indeed.
 
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#231
#231
Septic said:
No dog in their fight, just got tired of seeing "Patriots" misspell what should have been learned in 5th grade civics.
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I have no dog in your hunt either. But as a severe dyslexic with a masters degree in psychology who’s successfully run a business for decades but is something lucky to spell his own name correctly.....I find the spellin argument a sign of weakness as it only comes up when a beating is being administered.
 
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#232
#232
Septic said:
Why would you assume I believe it doesn't? I'm not thumbing my nose at world leaders, especially our allies.

Trumpers took pride in voicing their disdain over other world leaders comments about the dotard, apparently you seem to care again. Weird.
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lmao Sure thing.
 
#234
#234
Orangeslice13 said:
I have no dog in your hunt either. But as a severe dyslexic with a masters degree in psychology who’s successfully run a business for decades but is something lucky to spell his own name correctly.....I find the spellin argument a sign of weakness as it only comes up when a beating is being administered.
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I wasn't involved in an argument.

Think of it as a public service announcement.
 
#236
#236
My concern over what other world leaders think remains the same. It's nil. But to some, that opinion meant so much under Trump. Now it doesn't. That's called hypocrisy. And if anyone cares now when they didn't before, that's hypocrisy as well. None of that changes my opinion of Biden and his mental acuity. Or that I think Putin would destroy him in a debate. And I'm not expressing what I want, just what I think would happen.
 
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#237
#237
Weezer said:
My concern over what other world leaders think remains the same. It's nil. But to some, that opinion meant so much under Trump. Now it doesn't. That's called hypocrisy. And if anyone cares now when they didn't before, that's hypocrisy as well. None of that changes my opinion of Biden and his mental acuity. Or that I think Putin would destroy him in a debate. And I'm not expressing what I want, just what I think would happen.
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The only time anyone should be concerned about what other world leaders think about our president is when they think he is weak. When they think he‘s a nationalistic ******* then you know he’s doing a good job.
 
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#238
#238
hog88 said:
The only time anyone should be concerned about what other world leaders think about our president is when they think he is weak. When they think he‘s a nationalistic ******* then you know he’s doing a good job.
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I still don't care. But if they think Biden is weak, I agree.
 
#240
#240
RockyTop85 said:
If you had a point, I must have missed it.
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My point is you have completely embarrassed yourself by claiming things like oh the capital riot was meant to change the government. That’s just plain dumb. It never had a chance to change anything. Everyone knows that. But continue to beat your drum. I see septic tank likes your posts. That says a lot.
 
#241
#241
hog88 said:
I like it when they hate our president, it generally means he’s putting the USA before them.
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At the risk of repeating myself, he's the Rodney Dangerfield of world leaders.

Except it ain't a damn bit funny.
 
#242
#242
hog88 said:
I like it when they hate our president, it generally means he’s putting the USA before them.
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I don't think Putin likes Biden very much, but I really don't read much into that.
 
#243
#243
BigOrangeTrain said:
My point is you have completely embarrassed yourself by claiming things like oh the capital riot was meant to change the government. That’s just plain dumb. It never had a chance to change anything. Everyone knows that. But continue to beat your drum. I see septic tank likes your posts. That says a lot.
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Capitol.

😁
 
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#244
#244
Weezer said:
My concern over what other world leaders think remains the same. It's nil. But to some, that opinion meant so much under Trump. Now it doesn't. That's called hypocrisy. And if anyone cares now when they didn't before, that's hypocrisy as well. None of that changes my opinion of Biden and his mental acuity. Or that I think Putin would destroy him in a debate. And I'm not expressing what I want, just what I think would happen.
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What about those that cared then and care now as well? Where on the hypocrisy scale does that land?
 
#245
#245
BigOrangeTrain said:
My point is you have completely embarrassed yourself by claiming things like oh the capital riot was meant to change the government. That’s just plain dumb. It never had a chance to change anything. Everyone knows that. But continue to beat your drum. I see septic tank likes your posts. That says a lot.
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Well, I can’t argue with flawless logic unsupported conclusions like this. I bow to your copious experience with being just plain dumb.
 
#247
#247
I tend to think we've drifted way off track here (like usual) and the simple fact remains, if Biden got on stage with any debate with a world leader including Putin, it would be a national embarrassment.

Putin's going to do what Putin does best. He put the ball in Biden's court and knew it was going to be a disaster. He wins if Biden refuses. He certainly wins if Biden accepts.

One thing is for certain, I do not want Biden negotiating with any world leader on our behalf.
 
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#248
#248
Septic said:
I don't think that the incompetence can be used as an excuse. They were there to disrupt congress and prevent the vote and violence was their tool - that their plan was ill conceived and poorly executed isn't the pass you think it is.

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Again that's a protest, not a coup. Arrest the violent and move on.

Just because you or I dont like the subject matter of the protest doesnt make it a coup.
 
#249
#249
RockyTop85 said:
It absolutely is what you’ve referred to as a probability argument. That’s just an asinine statement. You’ve made the same argument six (now seven) different ways and every time it is some flaw in their execution (e.g. “so few people”) and the fact that the whole thing couldn’t produce a certain result. Usually, the result you’re asking after isn’t even necessary for it to have been a coup (e.g. “create a new government.”)

Ok. I’ve already conceded it was poorly planned, delusional, and based on a number of mistakes of fact. It had no realistic hope of being successful. These aren’t the best and brightest people and many of them live in an alternate reality. That’s not news to anybody who isn’t one of them. None of that matters.

What matters is 1. intent and 2. actions in furtherance of that intent.

The videos of people at the Capitol saying that they wanted to overturn the election speak to their intent and are generally consistent with the statements on Parler, Facebook, Twitter, and VN. The subsequent statements are also generally consistent. Donald Trump was, at that time, engaged in a months-long campaign to overturn the election. He said the day before that he wanted Pence to overturn the election. This was a grass roots movement to support that objective. The best evidence of this is that when Pence didn’t overturn the election, they turned on him en masse. There would be no other justification to turn on him at that point, other than that they wanted him to throw out the votes and overturn the election. Therefore, their intent was to overturn the election.

Overturning the election in that manner is unconstitutional. It is inconsistent with our form of government. The result would be, definitionally, a different form of government. Therefore, the intent to illegally overturn an election and suddenly install an unelected autocrat is the intent to carry out a coup.

Their actions furthered this intent by placing a violent, intimidating mob inside the Capitol where the vote was taking place. They dressed in combat cosplay. They brought or fashioned weapons. They fought their way in. They brought or confiscated zip tie restraints. These actions are all in furtherance of subduing or intimidating resistance to an objective. They were, thankfully, unsuccessful at doing more than delaying the vote.

The good faith (I guess?) arguments you’ve made are all endemic to you. You refuse to acknowledge statements about their intent. You refuse to fundamental civics. That doesn’t mean those statements don’t show intent. That doesn’t meant that an autocracy can exist within our constitutional form of government. Those things remain true regardless of any willful decision to ignore them.

The Pence thing, I’ve already covered. There’s no way you followed what happened and honestly thought your portrayal of it above was honest, accurate, and a meaningful rebuttal. So at this point I assume we transitioned into the bad faith arguments.

I think with the third point you’re trying to analogize something that clearly isn’t even close to a coup with a coup to make it seem like some sort of slippery slope. Yours is so obviously unrelated to overturning the government that I can’t really tell.

With the fourth, you seem to be trying to put words in my mouth but, again it’s hard to tell what relevant point you’re making because it starts out seeming a bit hysterical and just gets worse.
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Interview any protest with hundreds and you find exactly what you found in the Capitol. Outliers who said something beyond the scope of the protest. Like the mostly peaceful protests in the summer.

The intent of a few doesnt match the actions of the many. That's why I keep saying it's not a probability argument. You are assigning worse case scenarios to a situation where actual worse case scenarios would be miles higher.

Stealing a podium and carrying zip ties equals a coup. Lol. This was the first worldiest coup I have ever heard of. I didnt know my local grocery store carried weapons of government overthrow.

You continue applying an absurd standard.

They were protesting results, our consitution allows that. Now they way they did it isnt allowed, but that doesnt change it from what it was.
 
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