Rep Massie posts gun photo

#551
#551
n_huffhines said:
Yeah, but you're counting it from its peak, so it dropped 32% in 9 years* and then dropped 36% from a much lower number in just 4 years. The rate of reduction greatly improved and also kept going.

*and for all we know, that 470 figure was an outlier. The even starker reduction that came after enactment is definitely not a fluke because we got to see it through
Click to expand...
The "peak" is purely based on what luther provided. I have no idea what or when their real peak was. I googled but didnt find anything.

How is it clearly not a fluke? As pointed out 96 was an outlier, a return to the decreasing trend would require a larger correction than the normal year to year. And it would be nothing more than statistical norms. Norms is probably the incorrect term.
 
#552
#552
LouderVol said:
The year the law came out? As a one year outlier?

What's happened since 2011? 188 to 229. That's a trend, not a one year instance.
Click to expand...
Probably a slower rate of increase than that of the population.

Plus, that in no way fits the definition of an outlier; not even close.
 
#553
#553
n_huffhines said:
It turns out the large majority of Australia's gun deaths are suicides, and as Luther pointed out, gun suicides are far more successful than other methods, so when you prevent 200-300 gun suicides per year in Australia, only a fraction of those people are going to find a successful way to kill themselves.

Guns in Australia — Firearms, gun law and gun control
Click to expand...

They have less guns than us and more suicides. Asian countries have less guns than Australian’s and more suicides. I’ve never seen any real correlation in gun control and/or ownership and suicide rates. But there are massive cultural differences (Asian high, white high but less than Asian, black low).

So any issues with suicides in Australia are far more likely cultural issues in Australia than guns.

Yes, gun suicides are more effective. Another aspect here though is gender. Men are more likely to be successful than women and are more likely to use guns. I imagine if you take the data on suicides and then separate in by gender, you’ll find men are still far more likely to be successful than women regardless of method used and that the real issue is desire to die vs attention seeking.
 
  • Like
Reactions: hog88
#554
#554
n_huffhines said:
Yeah, but you're counting it from its peak, so it dropped 32% in 9 years* and then dropped 36% from a much lower number in just 4 years. The rate of reduction greatly improved and also kept going.

*and for all we know, that 470 figure was an outlier. The even starker reduction that came after enactment is definitely not a fluke because we got to see it through
Click to expand...

Are you actually supporting Australian gun laws?
 
#555
#555
Vol8188 said:
They have less guns than us and more suicides. Asian countries have less guns than Australian’s and more suicides. I’ve never seen any real correlation in gun control and/or ownership and suicide rates. But there are massive cultural differences (Asian high, white high but less than Asian, black low).

So any issues with suicides in Australia are far more likely cultural issues in Australia than guns.

Yes, gun suicides are more effective. Another aspect here though is gender. Men are more likely to be successful than women and are more likely to use guns. I imagine if you take the data on suicides and then separate in by gender, you’ll find men are still far more likely to be successful than women regardless of method used and that the real issue is desire to die vs attention seeking.
Click to expand...

?

I'm finding our suicide rate is higher. But I'm not understanding the point. Of course suicide is a cultural issue. The point isn't that Australia is doing better than others with suicide. The point is that it's doing much better than it used to be doing with gun suicide.

Imagine a way to support that with data.

1638976703093.png
 
#556
#556
luthervol said:
I think it is similar to a "lib" congresswoman having a Christmas photo made with her and each member of her family holding up signs that say "I support abortion", "woman's body, woman's choice", "pro-choice", and her young son sitting there holding a sign that says "No man should tell a woman what to do with her body".

However that photo would go over with you, is probably like how this nut's gun photo went over with me.
Click to expand...

One could use the constitution as reference. The other not so much.
 
#558
#558
Vol8188 said:
Are you actually supporting Australian gun laws?
Click to expand...

Jesucristo.

Are we so biased that an admission that the other side has some supportive data means that we support their position?

I can admit he has a good data point without changing where I stand on personal liberty.
 
#563
#563
n_huffhines said:
?

I'm finding our suicide rate is higher. But I'm not understanding the point. Of course suicide is a cultural issue. The point isn't that Australia is doing better than others with suicide. The point is that it's doing much better than it used to be doing with gun suicide.

Imagine a way to support that with data.

View attachment 418651
Click to expand...

The number I thought I saw earlier was 16.9 or so. I see 17 on the table you have. It’s possible I compared that number to the year the US was at 14.5.

Australia now has more guns than it used to yet suicide numbers are better. That seems to go counter to your argument.

My point is simple. There’s no correlation between gun ownership and suicide rates. Yes, gun suicides are more successful but so are all male suicide attempts.
 
  • Like
Reactions: hog88
#567
#567
n_huffhines said:
Jesucristo.

Are we so biased that an admission that the other side has some supportive data means that we support their position?

I can admit he has a good data point without changing where I stand on personal liberty.
Click to expand...

That’s why I phrased it as a question. If I were doing as you accuse me, I wouldn’t have asked.
 
#568
#568
luthervol said:
Holding that sign on your Christmas card certainly is.
And none of them would believe in killing a baby, so your point is moot.
Click to expand...

If they’re holding signs supporting abortion then they most definitely would believe in killing babies.
 
#569
#569
luthervol said:
Far fewer guns would be making their way into the hands of criminals.
Click to expand...

You do know the CDC disagrees with you right? You’ve also got to accept the US has relatively low homicide and crime rates. Especially among white gun owners.

So do you just oppose/deny science (I think that’s what you’re supposed to say when someone disagrees with the cdc)? Or do you just have an issue with black gun ownership (anyone who supports laws with disproportionate outcomes supports white supremacy according to the left)?

Edit: The real question you have to address before you can proclaim guns are the problem is why is the white homicide rate on par with Europe if guns are the problem you believe they are?
 
  • Like
Reactions: hog88
#571
#571
C-south said:
If they’re holding signs supporting abortion then they most definitely would believe in killing babies.
Click to expand...
Nope. That is 100% false.
That's as absurd as saying anyone taking a picture of themselves holding guns supports school shootings.
Equally absurd notions.
 
#572
#572
luthervol said:
Nope. That is 100% false.
That's as absurd as saying anyone taking a picture of themselves holding guns supports school shootings.
Equally absurd notions.
Click to expand...

You do agree abortion is killing another human right? And taking a photo is not killing another human?
 
New posts
You must log in or register to reply here.

VN Store



Back
Top