Serious QB discussion

[Creek Bottoms]

Trot the third stringer out there. He could be the next Bennett IV.

 

[volfan102455]

Absolutely not. The only concern I've ever had about Heupel is his continued lovefest for Milton despite him having over a dozen games worth of tape showing he's not a capable QB in the SEC. There should be no doubt he's the best coach we've had since Fulmer though. In fact, I think he's so good that he's merely a QB away from winning not only 1 ring but maybe even 3 rings in his career as a Volunteer head coach. That's how highly I think of him.

If you think that highly of him then you should know that he knows better than YOU which players to play in order to give the team the best chance to win. And he seems to be all about winning verses trashing a year because some fans don't like Joe.

 

[Unconditional Surrender]

I think Coach Heupel will do what gives us the best chance to win. If he thinks leaving Joe in will create a loss and pulling him will create a win, he'll pull him.

Until that's clear, really really really CLEAR to Josh Heupel, I expect Joe to play. Previously, Halzle said Nico couldn't execute the offense any better than Joe when directly asked about Nico getting quality playing time instead of Joe.

That's where the coaches are. That's where I am.

If that's true, here are the three options:

1. Halzle is lying because that's what you do when asked that kind of question (very likely)

2. They are wrong and Nico needs snaps to quickly elevate his game. Elite talent tends to do this. (also somewhat likely).

3. Nico sucks (highly unlikely but if he is truly worse than Milton and offers no better chance to win then I hope we are recruiting over him.)

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

I think Heupel and Nico mutually agreed to a redshirt after he wasn’t able to go in against Austin Peay. Of course, that’s out the window if Joe gets hurt, but Nico can play against UConn and Vandy and still maintain the RS.

Originally, I believed Nico would redshirt and that would be good. Folks here explained that there's little chance Nico stays beyond 3 years at this level.

When he starts next year and if he's incredible, he will be sure to leave in 3. If he really balls out, he'd be crazy to need a redshirt year.

Granted, if he's not good and gets portaled over/recruited over in a year or two, that redshirt might help him but I seriously doubt Nico nor Heupel see things going that way.

 

[Majors]

Spencer Rattler is a much better QB than Joe Milton. I'd have taken TAMU's QB last weekend over Joe Milton personally.

Both QB’s 0-2
Joe 2-0

Now you’re trolling

 

[Unconditional Surrender]

Nico doesn't care about a redshirt lol

 

[Flipdaddy]

We're 5 and 1.

Thanks to the defense and our running game. If you think Milton has had anything to do with our wins, you’re delusional or fooling yourself. Eventually a quarterback is going to have to get us win. What’s your confidence in that scenario? Probably going to happen this weekend. Even if Milton plays lights out and we beat Alabama, you can’t deny he’s almost gotten us beat every game.

 

[JHuntVols]

Rattler is 2-4 and has lost to every team of importance SC has played. They beat Furman and barely beat MSU. Why would you want him? As good as he may be in your eyes - he hasn't lead his team to victories.

Lmao so wait... Rattler allowed 41 points to a mediocre Florida team a few nights ago? I didn't know he was THAT important of a two way player. Stop thinking of wins as a QB stat; it's an insult to the entire team. I would much rather have Rattler, because that same QB last year absolutely ripped us. Name me ONE TIME you've seen Milton play to that level. I'll wait for you to play and record a NCAA 14 game and post it on here, because that's the only way you'd ever see Milton play well.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

None of what I said implied it was an emotional or knee jerk reaction. I have no doubt at halftime he looked how poorly Hurts has played, and he thought that Tua could do no worse and hopefully provide a spark on a stagnant offense (sound familiar?) The point of this is that it's an obvious counterexample to the idea that you dogmatically stick to the starting quarterback regardless of how they play and who is waiting behind them. Why can't you understand that?

I'm not saying that. I SAID if Nico has progressed and is ready and is needed by the team, he will play. Until he is, he won't.

Halzle said directly: Nico cannot execute the offense better than Joe.

Until that changes or Joe can't go, Nico doesn't play.

 

[Unconditional Surrender]

I'm not saying that. I SAID if Nico has progressed and is ready and is needed by the team, he will play. Until he is, he won't.

Halzle said directly: Nico cannot execute the offense better than Joe.

Until that changes or Joe can't go, Nico doesn't play.

The implication that Halzle would call for a QB change in a press conference is not a smart one. Why do you all keep bringing this up?

 

[cherokeeeVOL]

Originally, I believed Nico would redshirt and that would be good. Folks here explained that there's little chance Nico stays beyond 3 years at this level.

When he starts next year and if he's incredible, he will be sure to leave in 3. If he really balls out, he'd be crazy to need a redshirt year.

Granted, if he's not good and gets portaled over/recruited over in a year or two, that redshirt might help him but I seriously doubt Nico nor Heupel see things going that way.

I had a similar opinion and got roasted pretty good for it. Seemed to me that a true freshman needs a year to develop physically and mentally and now it sure seems like it really will happen. Not saying that was the staff's original plan for him but definitely looks like it's going to go that way barring a catastrophic injury.

 

[Majors]

t? Tua only got playing time in 2017 for mop duty before coming into the national championship game

I stand corrected. He was the backup until the final half of the last game.

 

[Batman1948]

I agree. What do you think about the 2 qb thing kind of like what Florida did with Leak/Tebow? Put Milton in for options, hand offs and QB sneaks and Nico in for passing.

That would just be letting the defense know what's coming

 

[Unconditional Surrender]

I had a similar opinion and got roasted pretty good for it. Seemed to me that a true freshman needs a year to develop physically and mentally and now it sure seems like it really will happen. Not saying that was the staff's original plan for him but definitely looks like it's going to go that way barring a catastrophic injury.

If you got roasted it was for implying that there is some universe where Nico will be here in 2027. It's laughable.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

If that's true, here are the three options:

1. Halzle is lying because that's what you do when asked that kind of question (very likely)

2. They are wrong and Nico needs snaps to quickly elevate his game. Elite talent tends to do this. (also somewhat likely).

3. Nico sucks (highly unlikely but if he is truly worse than Milton and offers no better chance to win then I hope we are recruiting over him.)

I've repeatedly said: if Heupel is wrong about Nico not being ready and wrong that Joe doesn't give us a better chance to win, we've got much bigger problems than Nico and Joe.

If you don't believe in Heupel's ability to judge QBs at this point in his career of coaching QBs and developing offenses, TN is very very screwed if you're correct.

 

[JHuntVols]

If you think that highly of him then you should know that he knows better than YOU which players to play in order to give the team the best chance to win. And he seems to be all about winning verses trashing a year because some fans don't like Joe.

Do you not think Nico can average 200 yards a game with a 60% completion percentage in this offense? Do you think that lowly of Heupel that he (and the entire recruiting world) missed that badly on evaluating Nico?

I'll be frank with you though. He didn't see that Hooker was significantly better than Milton. That by itself proves that he or any HC isn't infallible. I just want him to make the right choice and simply give Nico a chance like he's given Milton chance after chance after chance.

 

[Delmar]

I thought we were all here to discuss what should happen and not what will happen... I don't expect Milton to actually be benched at all this year. The two ways you said are the only ways I see that happening too. E.g., he literally misses every throw before half time against a team like AL or GA. Now that certainly is possible given Milton's accuracy, but it's likely he'll eventually hit a screen! My problem is that your group doesn't base performance on live games, you're too risk averse, you greatly overestimate the skill of Milton, and you frankly insult Nico (and thereby the coaching staffs recruiting evaluations) by implying he's not capable of playing up to the so called "standard" that Milton has set for him. You base a QB's value merely on practice reports. We're constantly told that Nico can't handle the offense or isn't better than Milton for one reason or another. There's no plausible reason to ever start Nico regardless of Milton's performance within that framework; you're just stuck with Milton until the offseason when he's gone, and then practice can tell them all who to start for next year. Saying that, you have 0 credibility when you inevitability question his ability after he gets shut down (again) by a good defense.

You didn’t address what I said about the reason Joe got the nod over Hendon last year. It was because of preseason practice performances. That is what happened and I’m not going to waste time repeating it again. Fortunately for us, something clicked with Hendon when he got in the games.

You guys can talk about what “should” happen till the cows come home. I “should” have been born looking like Robert Redford and as rich as Bill Gates but that didn’t happen. I don’t waste time with “should” when I don’t control it. Neither your nor my opinion count for anything in the decision. It’s up to Josh and he is a lot more experienced than we are. He’s going to roll with Joe until he thinks Nico is ready. Obviously he doesn’t think so at this point and we have to go with it. End of discussion.!

 

[volfan102455]

Lmao so wait... Rattler allowed 41 points to a mediocre Florida team a few nights ago? I didn't know he was THAT important of a two way player. Stop thinking of wins as a QB stat; it's an insult to the entire team. I would much rather have Rattler, because that same QB last year absolutely ripped us. Name me ONE TIME you've seen Milton play to that level. I'll wait for you to play and record a NCAA 14 game and post it on here, because that's the only way you'd ever see Milton play well.

You are a troll - that is now obvious. I'm sure the SC fans are celebrating the victory their QB had last Saturday. Just as I am sure A&M is celebrating the victory their QB had this Saturday and last Saturday. The teams lost, but the QB won. Time to celebrate for them.

 

[JHuntVols]

Both QB’s 0-2
Joe 2-0

Now you’re trolling

I don't take treating wins as a QB stat seriously. It shows a complete lack of understanding of football as a team sport.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

The implication that Halzle would call for a QB change in a press conference is not a smart one. Why do you all keep bringing this up?

It's not just that, it's also what Saban said, basically, "the kid has progressed through the season and I believed he was ready AND he offered skills Hurts couldn't (specifically, Saban has also said about that game..... he felt Tua could pass better than Hurts.)

If Nico plays, they believe he's ready AND they believe he offers skills we need to win that Joe doesn't have.

They aren't there yet. It's not like they're intentionally playing worse players unless there's injury or discipline involved. Why would any coach do that?

If they're wrong and aren't good coaches, we're definitely screwed long-term.

 

[JHuntVols]

You are a troll - that is now obvious. I'm sure the SC fans are celebrating the victory their QB had last Saturday. Just as I am sure A&M is celebrating the victory their QB had this Saturday and last Saturday. The teams lost, but the QB won. Time to celebrate for them.

Nah. What they should be doing is, "how the *** did our defense and staff allow a Wisconsin QB to throw for over 400 yards on us? How could they allow 41 points to THAT Florida team?" If you can seriously sit there and type that Rattler was the reason for the loss against Florida, which is 100% the conclusion when thinking of a team's record as merely a function of the QB, then I can't help you sir.

 

[cherokeeeVOL]

If you got roasted it was for implying that there is some universe where Nico will be here in 2027. It's laughable.

Not what I was implying but the response sounds familiar.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

I had a similar opinion and got roasted pretty good for it. Seemed to me that a true freshman needs a year to develop physically and mentally and now it sure seems like it really will happen. Not saying that was the staff's original plan for him but definitely looks like it's going to go that way barring a catastrophic injury.

I got roasted and listened to them. It seems true to me now that if he's really a great QB and puts up crazy numbers in college, he'll leave ASAP.

If Heupel is unsure, he might try to convince him of a redshirt year but I can't imagine that would go over well with Nico. He's been really highly recruited and highly rated and I'll bet he believes his stay in college should be as short as possible.

I'm betting his eyes are focused on how quickly he can get to the league. A redshirt is useless for him.

 

[JHuntVols]

You didn’t address what I said about the reason Joe got the nod over Hendon last year. It was because of preseason practice performances. That is what happened and I’m not going to waste time repeating it again. Fortunately for us, something clicked with Hendon when he got in the games.

You guys can talk about what “should” happen till the cows come home. I “should” have been born looking like Robert Redford and as rich as Bill Gates but that didn’t happen. I don’t waste time with “should” when I don’t control it. Neither your nor my opinion count for anything in the decision. It’s up to Josh and he is a lot more experienced than we are. He’s going to roll with Joe until he thinks Nico is ready. Obviously he doesn’t think so at this point and we have to go with it. End of discussion.!

Bro I completely understood what you said, which is why I literally stated "You base a QB's value merely on practice reports". I laid out my problems with that mindset literally right before that summary of your position. You can reread it again. I think we're all aware that Heupel and the staff don't even remotely care what any of us say on this forum. I thought we were having a fun discussion of what SHOULD happen based on what WE have seen? If not, then this will be a boring forum. Just going to be post after post of, "Coach knows best! GBO!"

 

[Majors]

I don't take treating wins as a QB stat seriously. It shows a complete lack of understanding of football as a team sport.

That’s true, South Carolina as a team is 2-4, Texas AM as team has lost 3 games, with most recently back to back. Not much to understand after that.