The Great Labor Force Debate

#152
#152
DonjoVol said:
It wasn't competing with government in those cases. Many people left that industry and went elsewhere. That was the free market at work and not the government.
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The pandemic shut them down. They left and could collect govt money. Yes that did happen
 
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#153
#153
Sandman 423 said:
Why does it matter if someone's job is classified as unskilled ? Am I missing something?
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Have you not seen the condescending, holier than thou remarks people have made? You don't see an issue with that?

Once again. People depend on Walmart and McDonald's daily. Therefore those jobs are skilled and necessary for our society and economy to function. I never said they required a college education or even specialized training in many cases but they do require skills. All jobs require skills of some sort.
 
#155
#155
DonjoVol said:
For people on this board who claim to be highly skilled many lack basic reading comprehension skills.
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They respond emotionally when they get triggered by the idea of employees making a bit more money or having a bit more control.

That is what all if this fear and pearl clutching boils down to... especially with Ricky.
 
#156
#156
DonjoVol said:
Keep in mind this all started months ago when I simply said some jobs should be paid more. A few people like Ricky went ballistic just over that comment. Then this led to a skilled and unskilled debate. It's funny how they consider all these restaurant workers or people at Walmart unskilled but they have no problem to continue frequenting these places on a regular basis. My opinion is if jobs like that are needed that much then yes they are skilled jobs. And these people continue to prove it by going to these places. Many of them will today.

Ricky also has a personal issue with me and Ras for example because we won't go along with his worldview. So instead of acting like the VP in Healthcare that he is and being respectful he has resorted to acting like a middle school kid throwing around insults. And now this supposed VP in healthcare is insulting CNAs. No VP in healthcare would resort to that type of behavior.
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Lol so many errors here. To be expected
-you are the one who went ballistic because you still can’t accept the simple fact that unskilled labor is different than skilled labor and market costs show the value of each person and their job title. Some people deserve to make more $ than Others based on their status, education, experience and other factors.
- you continue to emotionally conflate this fact with “well you look down on others” or “why don’t you get going out to eat then” which are irrational statements based on what we actually are talking about. You are like a 5 year old trying to debate the subject.
- it’s a message board and I personally don’t care about anything you or Ras or anyone says because it’s a place for discussion not life or death. I have nothing personal against you because you are a nobody that I’ll never meet and you have no control or power over anything ever that would affect me or my family. Ras I look at as having a different type of issues but I think he gets extreme into conspiracy type paranoia and can be hypocritical but I still talk with him.
- who is throwing insults. You are flailing around like a kid fighting off his back, and bringing up my job and Army football and dick Cheney and Joe Biden lol. Focus son
- calling CNA or janitors unskilled labor isn’t an insult for the thousandth time. Our CEO and every manager there does this and understands what skilled Vs unskilled labor terms means. It’s not an insult, it’s terms used every day in the business world
 
#158
#158
Rasputin_Vol said:
It is still within the realm of possibility. May not happen right now, but for a period of time last year, nothing was off the table.
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That’s an extreme position but you refuse to own it. Much like your other comments about executing doctors and nurses. Extremism
 
#159
#159
NCFisher said:
Supply of, and demand or necessity for, the skill. I've explained unskilled is a term used for low-skilled labor, why semantically belabor it? In practicality, even Marxists understand this but would force a level, artificial worth - wage or benefits - upon the proles but not the technocrats.

They're skilled at doing nails, man; every person alive will never have a French pedi emergency.
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Where is the division between skilled and unskilled?
 
#160
#160
DonjoVol said:
Keep in mind this all started months ago when I simply said some jobs should be paid more. A few people like Ricky went ballistic just over that comment. Then this led to a skilled and unskilled debate. It's funny how they consider all these restaurant workers or people at Walmart unskilled but they have no problem to continue frequenting these places on a regular basis. My opinion is if jobs like that are needed that much then yes they are skilled jobs. And these people continue to prove it by going to these places. Many of them will today.
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A need doesn't equal a skill. What is skill behind washing dishes? What is the skill behind clearing tables. Mind you I'm not talking about a person, but the job requirements. Those are things that anyone should be able to with very little training. Whether it's a high school student or a retired architect that just wants a part time job to be around people.
 
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#162
#162
DonjoVol said:
You people need to learn to read. I said those jobs are skilled also. When people stop visiting restaurants on a regular basis like they do then I might change my mind.

For people on this board who claim to be highly skilled many lack basic reading comprehension skills.
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The first ones I listed are not skilled. They’re being able to perform basic tasks. What do people going to restaurants have to do with most of the people there being unskilled?
 
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#163
#163
ClearwaterVol said:
A cop is just about as useful in that situation.

An RN is able to task down. The question is are they willing.
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Sign guy = cop was your terrible analogy; I get to poke fun at that.
Sign guy isn't a trauma surgeon either. It still doesn't make him or the cop both unskilled or equally skilled, even if he's the best damned sign guy on the planet.

Well sure they would if that is demanded as a temporary or ongoing function of their job. They may also change occupation or employers if that is unacceptable to them.
 
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#164
#164
DonjoVol said:
Have you not seen the condescending, holier than thou remarks people have made? You don't see an issue with that?

Once again. People depend on Walmart and McDonald's daily. Therefore those jobs are skilled and necessary for our society and economy to function. I never said they required a college education or even specialized training in many cases but they do require skills. All jobs require skills of some sort.
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I make my living off of people that think that they are better than me. I just don't get why it matters what other people, much less ones that are only a screen name, think.
 
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#165
#165
utvolpj said:
The pandemic shut them down. They left and could collect govt money. Yes that did happen
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The pandemic didn't shut down the restaurant I worked at. The vast majority stayed open here. I don't know anyone I worked with who left to collect a government check.

Many of the retail places like Costco, Walmart and JCPenney got ahead of the curve and started paying higher wages before many of the restaurants did. Guess who they filled many of their openings with? Restaurant workers. So did manufacturing places and work at home jobs. Many restaurant workers left to where the grass was greener so to speak. Which left a shortage in many restaurants. At least that was the case here. I even know someone who left an accounting job to go to Walmart during the pandemic.

I had a friend who was a retail manager. They had to close for almost two months. When they opened back up only half the crew came back. So that should show you it wasn't restaurant workers sitting at home drawing checks.
 
#166
#166
Rasputin_Vol said:
They respond emotionally when they get triggered by the idea of employees making a bit more money or having a bit more control.

That is what all if this fear and pearl clutching boils down to... especially with Ricky.
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We aren’t the emotional ones in this debate comrade. We are spouting truth and facts in economic and business terms and you both are talking about what you “feel” is fair
 
#167
#167
Rickyvol77 said:
Hurts him in the feelz. He can’t sleep at night knowing executives are above him status wise in his own head
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To a degree you are correct, but I really think it is the way you look down your nose at hardworking people you nonetheless view as having little value. You view the white collar jobs as some how more important than the lowly folks on the front lines who are the only reason those white collar folks have a job.
 
#168
#168
ClearwaterVol said:
Where is the division between skilled and unskilled?
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I reiterate:
NCFisher said:
Supply of, and demand or necessity for, the skill. I've explained unskilled is a term used for low-skilled labor, why semantically belabor it? In practicality, even Marxists understand this but would force a level, artificial worth - wage or benefits - upon the proles but not the technocrats.

They're skilled at doing nails, man; every person alive will never have a French pedi emergency.
Click to expand...
 
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#169
#169
ClearwaterVol said:
Where is the division between skilled and unskilled?
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A good question. Me personally, I'm starting with something that requires unique education or certification.

But I realize there are jobs out there that take a lot of practice to be able to perform safely and effectively that may not require certification, like a forklift driver for example. Although I'd think a lot of companies would require you to go through an internal forklift training class to at least be able to do the job for that company.
 
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#170
#170
ClearwaterVol said:
To a degree you are correct, but I really think it is the way you look down your nose at hardworking people you nonetheless view as having little value. You view the white collar jobs as some how more important than the lowly folks on the front lines who are the only reason those white collar folks have a job.
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No I don’t. I view in Market terms that a janitor is unskilled labor that almost anyone can do and should be paid accordingly not as much as a physician or VP or lawyer etc. it’s not “looking down my nose” at anyone. You are bringing emotions and liberal feelings into something that’s not there.
 
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#171
#171
TheDeeble said:
A need doesn't equal a skill. What is skill behind washing dishes? What is the skill behind clearing tables. Mind you I'm not talking about a person, but the job requirements. Those are things that anyone should be able to with very little training. Whether it's a high school student or a retired architect that just wants a part time job to be around people.
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Dealing with the public is a skill and not everyone can do it. Being a bartender is a skill and not everyone can do it.
 
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#172
#172
Rickyvol77 said:
No I don’t. I view in Market terms that a janitor is unskilled labor that almost anyone can do and should be paid accordingly not as much as a physician or VP or lawyer etc. it’s not “looking down my nose” at anyone. You are bringing emotions and liberal feelings into something that’s not there.
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No, I am judging you based upon the content of your comments. You come across as holier than thou.
 
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