The Thread Where People Argue About Kneeling in the NFL (merged)

#3,626
#3,626
tumscalcium said:
Right. The problem has always been that the NFL isn’t throwing money at these causes? Now that they are they’ll stop acting like little *****es?
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If understand correctly the problem has been about police brutality. I suppose the end goal is to help curb that. One would imagine that donating to causes that are working to remedy the issues, might prove effective. I’m not certain what more I can tell you Tumscalcium?

If by “acting like little *****es” you mean peacefully protesting? I think they might. Nothing in the article states that a mandate has been put forth, but it looks like the league has upheld their end of the bargain, so it would be up to te players to operate in kind.
 
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#3,627
#3,627
n_huffhines said:
My point remains the same, so who is stupid?

You moved the goal posts. First, you say "why aren't they giving back" and when they do, instead of giving them credit, your response is "what is this thing I demanded that they do supposed to fix?"

You'll never be happy with them because they are minorities complaining about race. You only tolerate it when whites complain about race because you are a crotchety old white man.
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Sounds like you have a case of white guilt and a prejudice against older people.
 
#3,628
#3,628
Nerd-Vol said:
If understand correctly the problem has been about police brutality. I suppose the end goal is to help curb that. One would imagine that donating to causes that are working to remedy the issues, might prove effective. I’m not certain what more I can tell you Tumscalcium?

If by “acting like little *****es” you mean peacefully protesting, I think they might.
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That’s what we’ve been told all along.

So now the narrative is that all they wanted was the NFL, of all people, to throw a ton of money at it? It’s not changing what thy perceive as bad, but just throw money at it? Now they’re good? Now they’ll quit acting like little *****es? It was he NFL not throwing money at it all along?
 
#3,630
#3,630
tumscalcium said:
That’s what we’ve been told all along.

So now the narrative is that all they wanted was the NFL, of all people, to throw a ton of money at it? It’s not changing what thy perceive as bad, but just throw money at it? Now they’re good? Now they’ll quit acting like little *****es? It was he NFL not throwing money at it all along?
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You seem insistent on making donating a pejorative, when you call it “throwing money at it”. Not to get off track, but isn’t making financial donations to anything “throwing money at it”?

Like mentioned earlier, the players were protesting about police brutality. The league has stepped up and the players have also stepped up to give money to help combat the issue. I’m not certain what needed to happen to make this a satisfactory result in your eyes?
 
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#3,631
#3,631
Nerd-Vol said:
You seem insistent on making donating a pejorative, when you call it “throwing money at it”. Not to get off track, but isn’t making financial donations to anything “throwing money at it”?

Like mentioned earlier, the players were protesting about police brutality. The league has stepped up and the players have also stepped up to give money to help combat the issue. I’m not certain what needed to happen to make this a satisfactory result in your eyes?
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What would be a satisfactory result in your eyes? Not being a jerk here , just wanting to know what the end game is here. Under the Obama administration there was a great deal done to help these causes that people seem to ignore. Then all of a sudden it becomes a thing. I’m not suggesting we can’t always improve, but I think the majority of this is manufactured.
 
#3,632
#3,632
RDU VOL#14 said:
What would be a satisfactory result in your eyes?
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I think this is a pretty decent result. It would be impossible to snap a finger and make police brutality disappear, so I think a dedicated effort to working towards the goal is essential. It appears that is the idea of the donations.

Overall I think the protests were effective:

1. They were peaceful
2. They garnered a lot of attention
3. The league felt compelled to do something because of the protests and the response to it.

I understand that the protests upset a lot of people, and I understand why. That said a lot of peaceful protests in the past have been upsetting and still been effective.

Im not going to weigh in on the other parts of your post. Far too much to be unboxed and discussed.
 
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#3,633
#3,633
RDU VOL#14 said:
What would be a satisfactory result in your eyes? Not being a jerk here , just wanting to know what the end game is here. Under the Obama administration there was a great deal done to help these causes that people seem to ignore. Then all of a sudden it becomes a thing. I’m not suggesting we can’t always improve, but I think the majority of this is manufactured.
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To me the end game should be to decriminalize drugs and pardon non-violent drug offenders. Not only is this the right policy from a responsible government perspective, it would make a huge and positive difference to so many (people of all color and even people in other countries) now and forever, and it would greatly help relations between minorities and the police. The majority of the distrust of the police in inner cities stems from the war on drugs.
 
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#3,636
#3,636
Nerd-Vol said:
You seem insistent on making donating a pejorative, when you call it “throwing money at it”. Not to get off track, but isn’t making financial donations to anything “throwing money at it”?

Like mentioned earlier, the players were protesting about police brutality. The league has stepped up and the players have also stepped up to give money to help combat the issue. I’m not certain what needed to happen to make this a satisfactory result in your eyes?
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Bold - Yep. Doesn’t change anything.

What does the NFL have to do with anything regarding their “Protesting”? All the players wanted was the NFL to throw money at this stuff? That’s it? That’s all this was about?


Also, I’ve already read where not all players are on board with this.


What’s the real issue? What’s the real problem? These players don’t even know.
 
#3,638
#3,638
I think this is probably just really smart virtue signaling in the sense that the NFL is spending what 14 mill/yr for 7 years? If this appeases the players because they are saying to them "look we heard you, we care" and the players stop kneeling in general, then they can say to the fans "look the players aren't protesting the anthem anymore" and in the end they will make much more than they are spending. But this is all from the perspective that the NFL only cares about the bottom line (which I believe). The only other ways to deal with it would have either been to promote it or outlaw it and either way they would have been pissing off half of the fan base. This seems like the best way to appease both sides. In the end, I have no idea if it will actually accomplish anything.
 
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#3,639
#3,639
zreeves said:
I think this is probably just really smart virtue signaling in the sense that the NFL is spending what 14 mill/yr for 7 years? If this appeases the players because they are saying to them "look we heard you, we care" and the players stop kneeling in general, then they can say to the fans "look the players aren't protesting the anthem anymore" and in the end they will make much more than they are spending. But this is all from the perspective that the NFL only cares about the bottom line (which I believe). The only other ways to deal with it would have either been to promote it or outlaw it and either way they would have been pissing off half of the fan base. This seems like the best way to appease both sides. In the end, I have no idea if it will actually accomplish anything.
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That’s a very reasonable thought on this.
 
#3,640
#3,640
zreeves said:
I think this is probably just really smart virtue signaling in the sense that the NFL is spending what 14 mill/yr for 7 years? If this appeases the players because they are saying to them "look we heard you, we care" and the players stop kneeling in general, then they can say to the fans "look the players aren't protesting the anthem anymore" and in the end they will make much more than they are spending. But this is all from the perspective that the NFL only cares about the bottom line (which I believe). The only other ways to deal with it would have either been to promote it or outlaw it and either way they would have been pissing off half of the fan base. This seems like the best way to appease both sides. In the end, I have no idea if it will actually accomplish anything.
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It won’t solve anything.

Police brutality, wealth inequality, racism, they are all open ended concepts. It’s like when the food bank says they are working to end hunger. Well that’s impossible because someone will always be hungry. You will never have 0 cases of police brutality. You will never have “wealth equality”, whatever that might mean. It’s the war on drugs for social justice. So they’ve given them some money, it’s absolutely no guarantee they stop doing what they’re doing. Or that they won’t pick it up again in the future. The reasons for protest are as muddy as the goals. I don’t think this will be the watershed that causes millions to start watching again.

By the way Goodell is asking for $50M a year in salary and incentives.
 
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#3,641
#3,641
DancingOutlaw said:
It won’t solve anything.

Police brutality, wealth inequality, racism, they are all open ended concepts. It’s like when the food bank says they are working to end hunger. Well that’s impossible because someone will always be hungry. You will never have 0 cases of police brutality. You will never have “wealth equality”, whatever that might mean. It’s the war on drugs for social justice. So they’ve given them some money, it’s absolutely no guarantee they stop doing what they’re doing. Or that they won’t pick it up again in the future. The reasons for protest are as muddy as the goals. I don’t think this will be the watershed that causes millions to start watching again.

By the way Goodell is asking for $50M a year in salary and incentives.
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WTF? So the food bank should just give up and quit trying to supply food for people because they will never, ever be able to completely eliminate hunger?
 
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#3,645
#3,645
So basically nothing will change. Same ole sh!t different day to whine, kneel and raise fist in the air.

The NFL is paying for this, not the players. The players pushed for certain charities. It will only affect the ticket buyer, the jersey buyer etc.

Thanks Kap. I will never set foot in another NFL stadium.
 
#3,647
#3,647
AirVol said:
So basically nothing will change. Same ole sh!t different day to whine, kneel and raise fist in the air.

The NFL is paying for this, not the players. The players pushed for certain charities. It will only affect the ticket buyer, the jersey buyer etc.

Thanks Kap. I will never set foot in another NFL stadium.
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I haven't watched 5 minutes this year, and have no idea who's leading the league. Couldn't care less either at this point.
 
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#3,648
#3,648
n_huffhines said:
To me the end game should be to decriminalize drugs and pardon non-violent drug offenders. Not only is this the right policy from a responsible government perspective, it would make a huge and positive difference to so many (people of all color and even people in other countries) now and forever, and it would greatly help relations between minorities and the police. The majority of the distrust of the police in inner cities stems from the war on drugs.
Click to expand...

wnod.gif
 
#3,649
#3,649
tumscalcium said:
Bold - Yep. Doesn’t change anything.

What does the NFL have to do with anything regarding their “Protesting”? All the players wanted was the NFL to throw money at this stuff? That’s it? That’s all this was about?


Also, I’ve already read where not all players are on board with this.


What’s the real issue? What’s the real problem? These players don’t even know.
Click to expand...

Actually, I don't think the idea of throwing money around came from the players. I think the league has been trying to brainstorm on a way to resolve the issue without alienating people/fans that stand on both sides of the issue. So what the league did is approach the players with this idea... it is an easy solution for the league and it can get some good PR. In return, they can hope that is enough to get the players to stand for the anthem.

I guess one question I would have for those that oppose the players that stand for the flag is that if you convince them to stand after all of this, do you care if the players have a sincere appreciation for the flag and the country or do you just want them to just stand there and shut up whether they really care about the ceremony? Just wondering what the end game is for coercing people to do something they may not want to do. Are you looking for them to have a sincere respect for the flag or are just looking for them to conform? Just curious.
 
#3,650
#3,650
AirVol said:
So basically nothing will change. Same ole sh!t different day to whine, kneel and raise fist in the air.

The NFL is paying for this, not the players. The players pushed for certain charities. It will only affect the ticket buyer, the jersey buyer etc.

Thanks Kap. I will never set foot in another NFL stadium.
Click to expand...

That might not have been a bad idea by the league... have the players match a certain amount. Then you will really be able to see if the players will put their money where their mouths are.
 
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