The you don't want to get involved in this discussion thread (split)

#501
#501
you said:
It my opinion.... To me, football is a man's sport.... High school girls shouldn't be allowed either
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I'll give you a dollar if you call Michael Sams a HS girl to his face. Prepare to get your ass kicked by a girl.
 
#502
#502
wU-Tang Vol said:
Much different situation. Honestly, most people don't give a damn if he's gay or not. The media will make it a big deal, but in reality it's another player, playing football. His sexual preferences have nothing to do with football
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If most people didn't give a damn this thread wouldn't exist, and he wouldn't be the FIRST openly gay player in the NFL. If it wasn't a big deal many gay NFL players would already be "out". You might not think it's a big deal but go ask some gay people, they might have a different opinion.
 
#504
#504
I hope the Broncos draft him if my Bears don't.
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#505
#505
utvolpj said:
yet knew enough to keep religion out of the laws they wrote. I think you'd be surprised at most of their religious backgrounds if you studied them



people are simply getting dumber. Has more to do with not reading schoolbooks than it does with not reading a religious text
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Madison and Jefferson are considered to be the two main writers and neither were religious or Christian
 
#506
#506
wU-Tang Vol said:
Where is the evidence to support this? There is plenty of evidence showing the dropout rate in church, and the issues fade alluded to. Which is also referenced in the Bible before the second coming.
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where's the evidence to support the other? I'm more concerned with the dropout rate of schools than I am in more people sleeping in on Sunday. It is also completely possible to be a good person without ever setting foot in a church or reading scripture
 
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#507
#507
KnoxVillain said:
Pretty typical stuff. Smugness and ignorance define many believers.
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I will give you Christians (or ones that claim to be) can be hateful or sound that way at the very least). It clearly says in the Bible it is a sin. Again everyone has a sin they struggle with, some it may be pride, some gossip, some alcoholism, some drugs etc. The problem is they want us to accept it, but we should LOVINGLY tell them that while this is a sin, not hate them. We should not want anyone to live in sin.
 
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#508
#508
Ron Swanson said:
If most people didn't give a damn this thread wouldn't exist, and he wouldn't be the FIRST openly gay player in the NFL. If it wasn't a big deal many gay NFL players would already be "out". You might not think it's a big deal but go ask some gay people, they might have a different opinion.
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That's a fair point. I think I'm in the majority, however, that says who cares what they are? If the wanna be openly gay, hide it, straight, curious, or whatever, cool. What are your stats like? The thing is, a few 1,000 people on social media turn it into a big deal, and the national media blows it up until it forces people to choose sides.
 
#509
#509
TNVolsScott said:
I have to agree Butch. During my time in the Air Force, I have come across many Christians who kept the faith better than I (not that I don't try). They were also homosexual. I tend to judge people by their character and less by their sexual preference. Some of the character of the posters in here is questionable at best. My God believes in loving despite so-called sins, and forgiveness...I would ask you all to do the same.
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Finally, some insightful thoughts. I commend you both.
 
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#510
#510
volnpowell said:
I will give you Christians (or ones that claim to be) can be hateful or sound that way at the very least). It clearly says in the Bible it is a sin. Again everyone has a sin they struggle with, some it may be pride, some gossip, some alcoholism, some drugs etc. The problem is they want us to accept it, but we should LOVINGLY tell them that while this is a sin, not hate them. We should not want anyone to live in sin.
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or maybe you should not attempt to define sin for others
 
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#513
#513
utvolpj said:
yet knew enough to keep religion out of the laws they wrote. I think you'd be surprised at most of their religious backgrounds if you studied them



people are simply getting dumber. Has more to do with not reading schoolbooks than it does with not reading a religious text
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The founding fathers wanted to prevent the US government from establishing a state religion like the church of England. But they did not intend for that to mean that free people would be punished or prevented from expressing their religion in a public way, which you are starting to see shades of today.


Also, the decay on display in America (and I am not referring to the original topic of the thread) is not an educational one, it's a moral one.
 
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#514
#514
wU-Tang Vol said:
That's a fair point. I think I'm in the majority, however, that says who cares what they are? If the wanna be openly gay, hide it, straight, curious, or whatever, cool. What are your stats like? The thing is, a few 1,000 people on social media turn it into a big deal, and the national media blows it up until it forces people to choose sides.
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I agree with you, I don't care about sexuality of individuals. I don't judge people on that, certainly not athletes. I want my favorite team to win every single game they play, if some of the players are gay is irrelevant to me.

Of course the media loves a story but the fact is, the NFL is the #1 sport in America and not a single player is openly gay. So, now that Michael Sam has decided to say, "I'm gay" it's a story. Whether you or I give a damn. And it will likely snowball and many other gay athletes will come out over time and in 15, 25,50, whatever years it won't matter anymore. But being an openly gay athlete is a big deal in 2014 whether you or I care.
 
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#515
#515
volnpowell said:
I did not, God did. Again, we all struggle with sin. I think some make homosexuality to be worse than pride or gossip etc., but it is not.
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it's your opinion that God did since all we have is man's translaton of what they think he meant. All this "love the sinner, hate the sin" stuff is merely an attempt to try and appear nonjudgmental. The very act of declaring someone a sinner based on your personal set of morals is doing exactly that
 
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#516
#516
I find it funny alot of the same people that don't want someone's sexuality "rammed down your throat" have no problem with people getting on tv or other media and profess to us all about their christianity not that it matters to me cause if I don't want to watch, hear, or read about something I just ignore it.
 
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#517
#517
fade route said:
The founding fathers wanted to prevent the US government from establishing a state religion like the church of England. But they did not intend for that to mean that free people would be punished or prevented from expressing their religion in a public way, which you are starting to see shades of today.
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the persecuted Christian is one of the weakest arguments being peddled today. Only second behind the poor, persecuted white male

fade route said:
Also, the decay on display in America (and I am not referring to the original topic of the thread) is not an educational one, it's a moral one.
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that's great but morals can be separate from religion. You attempt to tie the 2 together which is ridiculous
 
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#518
#518
utvolpj said:
where's the evidence to support the other? I'm more concerned with the dropout rate of schools than I am in more people sleeping in on Sunday. It is also completely possible to be a good person without ever setting foot in a church or reading scripture
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I completely agree with you on all accounts. There is a tremendous drop out rate in churches compared to that of the '60's, 70's, and 80's. My church alone has seen a dropout rate of 35% in the past 3 years of our members. It is mostly the teenage crowd that drops out. Some return, most don't. However, I feel it is more than a coincidence that all the issues fade mentioned have been increased in the recent years, and many churches are having dropouts. I never said there aren't good people that do not attend church. There are plenty of amazing people that do not attend church. The dropout rates in schools are very alarming as well, but to your argument of the world becoming less intelligent, there are more students these days graduating college than there have ever been in the past.
 
#520
#520
fade route said:
Yes, logical and educated individuals, most of whom in addition to founding the country were Christians who publicly professed their belief and loyalty to Christ and Biblical teachings.

You may think the Bible is some old outdated book that has no relevance to modern society, but consider this: your line of thinking is on the rise in America. Unfortunately, so is the rate of children growing up in fatherless homes, child abuse, drug use, alcohol abuse, addiction to pornography, suicide rates, depression,violence among teens, etc, the list goes on. Coincidence?
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Yes, I would say the majority of it is coincidence. Those problems are far more complex than people abandoning religion.

wU-Tang Vol said:
Prayers sent
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:crazy: The standard Christianan response. Thanks for the favor, buddy!
 
#521
#521
fade route said:
Yes, logical and educated individuals, most of whom in addition to founding the country were Christians who publicly professed their belief and loyalty to Christ and Biblical teachings.

You may think the Bible is some old outdated book that has no relevance to modern society, but consider this: your line of thinking is on the rise in America. Unfortunately, so is the rate of children growing up in fatherless homes, child abuse, drug use, alcohol abuse, addiction to pornography, suicide rates, depression,violence among teens, etc, the list goes on. Coincidence?
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Only issues in the blue states, right?

But hey, the Bible! Where talking snakes happen.
 
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#522
#522
KnoxVillain said:
Yes, I would say the majority of it is coincidence. Those problems are far more complex than people abandoning religion.



:crazy: The standard Christianan response. Thanks for the favor, buddy!
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Hey, after we die, we get to sit in a hole in the ground! Forever!
 
#523
#523
utvolpj said:
it's your opinion that God did since all we have is man's translaton of what they think he meant. All this "love the sinner, hate the sin" stuff is merely an attempt to try and appear nonjudgmental. The very act of declaring someone a sinner based on your personal set of morals is doing exactly that
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The thing is homosexuality is a sin and you are right, it isn't worse than any other sin. Where it does fall into a different category is: Most people who commit sin and want to live a Christian life ask forgiveness for that sin when they commit it. People living and practicing homosexuality are continuing to live in it and thus want us to say, well it's ok, we're all sinners. They aren't seeking forgiveness of their wrong. A homosexual that refuses to give in to their sin, can be forgiven.
 
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#525
#525
Ron Swanson said:
Why are some people so against the idea that gay people might have been born gay?
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Why are some people so against the idea that maybe they weren't born gay?

I do not personally believe that people are not born gay, I believe that circumstances in life lead people to believe that they are gay. Can I prove it 100%? No. Can you prove me wrong 100%? No. This is what I choose to believe. That is the great thing about this country. We can agree to disagree.

I am a Christian and a pastor, I will not run up screaming and yelling that they are sinners going to hell because that isn't what Jesus would do. I believe in using compassion, friendship, love and trust to prove that just because we want to do something doesn't mean we have to is the proper way. The bible states that being gay is a sin, just as living with and having sexual relations out of wedlock is a sin, just as lusting after a man or woman, just as gluttony and not providing for you family is a sin. Sin is a choice, and we all have to choose between what is written as right and wrong in God's Word. We also must deal with those consequences.

I do want to say though thanks for all you bring to the board Ron. I appreciate your attitude and your positive mindset towards the team. Keep up the good work.
 
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