The you don't want to get involved in this discussion thread (split)

#751
#751
I made it through 13 pages and I honestly think I lost some valuable IQ points.
 
#752
#752
volprof said:
Simplistic is what we would call the bolded part of your post. Of course, people have been conquered throughout history. What kind of rationale is that?

Like I said before, share your pioneer courage to the Native Americans. I'm sure they'd love to hear all about it. Only been hearing about it the last 400 years.
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Next time I am at a Casino I will ask them if they remember Lewis and Clark.
 
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#753
#753
jp1 said:
So is someone born a pedophile or is it a sexual choice? We can both play these silly games.

Let me ask you a question....if you stick a homosexual male and a heterosexual female on a deserted island for 10 years what do you think would happen? Think any kids would be produced? Think they would love each other?

We can keep playing the game if you would like.
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Actually, yes, it's something between biology and social deterministic factors, just like homosexuality and just like heterosexuality. I know that's not a popular opinion, but who in their right mind would choose to be a pedophile? Now, obviously, one should not act on these desires, but this is much different from homosexuality. And be careful with pedophilia, particularly if you're of a Christian mindset. Many of the OT patriarchs would qualify as pedophiles in today's definition of the word.
 
#754
#754
volprof said:
Actually, yes, it's something between biology and social deterministic factors, just like homosexuality and just like heterosexuality. I know that's not a popular opinion, but who in their right mind would choose to be a pedophile? Now, obviously, one should not act on these desires, but this is much different from homosexuality. And be careful with pedophilia, particularly if you're of a Christian mindset. Many of the OT patriarchs would qualify as pedophiles in today's definition of the word.
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I'm assuming you will address my second question in your next post.
 
#755
#755
423Volfan said:
No problem at all. Most people really don't know that though. I was taught in school that all of our founding fathers were deeply religious (Christian). A little research though goes a long way. They were way more into their freemasonry that anything else.
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I was also taught they were Free masons and we're less than active in protestant activities. Both men Jefferson and Madison were however moved by a sort of another type of religion called Deism, look it up and enlighten yourself a little.
 
#756
#756
thebjd said:
Next time I am at a Casino I will ask them if they remember Lewis and Clark.
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Oh, you're making my father-in-law, the crazy conservative's, argument about justifying our treatment of Native Americans. Well, let me share this with you, sir. Yes, it is true that there are Native American tribes that benefit from casinos. How this justifies centuries of oppression and genocide I'm not sure, but fair enough. But here's what you left out: look up the current conditions of Indian reservations. They have among the highest (and often the highest) rates of crime, rape, alcoholism and drug abuse, and suicide of any ethnic group in this country. Furthermore, their educational systems and schools are below subpar. This is reality for the majority of Native Americans who actually live as Native Americans and don't just use their great-great-great grandmother's Indian ancestry as a federal stat-stuffer, so to speak.
 
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#758
#758
jp1 said:
I'm assuming you will address my second question in your next post.
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To address your second question, I really don't know. They may mate out of necessity; they may not. The man may discover that he is attracted to the woman afterall. This doesn't necessarily mean it was a decision made after careful arbitration. I used to hate cole slaw and now I like it. I have no clue why. To describe my liking cole slaw as a decision I made after contemplation, however, would be inaccurate. Just happened after time, and I have no clue why.

I take it you think your heterosexuality (I'm assuming) was arrived at after hours, days, weeks, if not even years, of careful thought?
 
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#760
#760
volprof said:
To address your second question, I really don't know. They may mate out of necessity; they may not. The man may discover that he is attracted to the woman afterall. This doesn't necessarily mean it was a decision made after careful arbitration. I used to hate cole slaw and now I like it. I have no clue why. To describe my liking cole slaw as a decision I made after contemplation, however, would be inaccurate. Just happened after time, and I have no clue why.
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You may like Cole slaw now because you discovered some made a different way, pretty simple. Same thing with me and broccoli I dislike it, but add cheese and I will eat it.
 
#761
#761
423Volfan said:
No problem at all. Most people really don't know that though. I was taught in school that all of our founding fathers were deeply religious (Christian). A little research though goes a long way. They were way more into their freemasonry that anything else.
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Actually I disagree. Most of the main leaders of the revolutionary movement were in fact Christian.
 
#762
#762
thebjd said:
Next time I am at a Casino I will ask them if they remember Lewis and Clark.
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You should ask them if they remember the diseases spread across north and South American by the Spanish that wipe out 50-80% of indigenous populations and made it possible for Europeans to easily settle.
 
#764
#764
jp1 said:
Actually I disagree. Most of the main leaders of the revolutionary movement were in fact Christian.
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Many weren't Christians or practiced a form of Christianity that would get them condemned today.

Thomas Jefferson, for instance, was a deist. He believed Jesus had a good message though and created the "red letter bible" which featured only the words of Jesus and none of the supernatural stuff.

Regardless, they wrote a constitution that doesn't reference religion at all (the word God doesn't appear in the constitution or Bill of rights) except to say that the government can't endorse one religion over another.
 
#765
#765
volprof said:
To address your second question, I really don't know. They may mate out of necessity; they may not. The man may discover that he is attracted to the woman afterall. This doesn't necessarily mean it was a decision made after careful arbitration. I used to hate cole slaw and now I like it. I have no clue why. To describe my liking cole slaw as a decision I made after contemplation, however, would be inaccurate. Just happened after time, and I have no clue why.

I take it you think your heterosexuality (I'm assuming) was arrived at after hours, days, weeks, if not even years, of careful thought?
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Actually I believe all people were born heterosexual and it's his or her choice to decide otherwise.

Obviously I believe I am right, just as in my example of the deserted island that a choice is made about being gay.

We can obviously disagree just stating my viewpoint.
 
#766
#766
UT_Dutchman said:
You may like Cole slaw now because you discovered some made a different way, pretty simple. Same thing with me and broccoli I dislike it, but add cheese and I will eat it.
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I understand that, but here's my point:

Why do you like the cheese? Why?
 
#767
#767
Darth_Shiveman said:
Many weren't Christians or practiced a form of Christianity that would get them condemned today.

Thomas Jefferson, for instance, was a deist. He believed Jesus had a good message though and created the "red letter bible" which featured only the words of Jesus and none of the supernatural stuff.

Regardless, they wrote a constitution that doesn't reference religion at all (the word God doesn't appear in the constitution or Bill of rights) except to say that the government can't endorse one religion over another.
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For every 1 of the leaders of the revolution that you name that were deists or freemasons I can name two who were Christians. I certainly agree that all of them werent, like Thomas Jefferson, but the majority were.
 
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#768
#768
jp1 said:
Actually I disagree. Most of the main leaders of the revolutionary movement were in fact Christian.
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A majority were god fearing Christians, but some; Jefferson, Madison, Franklin, and Washington were all Deist's. Look up John Locke for he is believed to have helped start that movement from the protestant faith.
 
#770
#770
volprof said:
I understand that, but here's my point:

Why do you like the cheese? Why?
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You seriously can't still be comparing taste with sexual preference?

Why do I like black cars compared to red ones. I choose to buy black ones because I think they look better.

See how stupid this is?
 
#771
#771
UT_Dutchman said:
A majority were god fearing Christians, but some; Jefferson, Madison, Franklin, and Washington were all Deist's. Look up John Locke for he is believed to have helped start that movement from the protestant faith.
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And Thomas Paine was a straight up atheist. However, the religion of the founding fathers isn't all that important.

What's important is that they wrote the documents out government is founded on to be religion neutrel.
 
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#772
#772
jp1 said:
Actually I believe all people were born heterosexual and it's his or her choice to decide otherwise.

Obviously I believe I am right, just as in my example of the deserted island that a choice is made about being gay.

We can obviously disagree just stating my viewpoint.
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And I respect that. I just have a hard time believing that I consciously decided to be a heterosexual man. And regarding your desert island scenario, I would also say that sexuality is fluid. We tend to think of it in absolutes: you're either straight or gay, but people can transition in-and-out and in-between and still have no clue why. For instance, you may or may not be physically attracted to the same type of woman you were just 5 or 10 or 15 years ago. Can you account for why you're attracted to a certain type of woman, and if your ideal type of woman has changed, can you account for that transition? And I'm talking about physical attraction, since this is what the gay debate boils down to as well. Can you account for your fondness for blondes over brunettes, just hypothetically speaking?

Although we tend to think of ourselves as stable, coherent beings, we are actually very fluid. In fact, we are often very irrational.
 
#773
#773
jp1 said:
For every 1 of the leaders of the revolution that you name that were deists or freemasons I can name two who were Christians. I certainly agree that all of them werent like Thomas Jefferson but the majority were.
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I am afraid you are going to be wrong. I have been trying to remember the number of Mason's who signed TDOI, I believe more than half were as well Deism was a newer way to look at ones surroundings and try to walk as if in Jesus shoes without believing in his divinity.
 
#774
#774
jp1 said:
You seriously can't still be comparing taste with sexual preference?

Why do I like black cars compared to red ones. I choose to buy black ones because I think they look better.

See how stupid this is?
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But why do you think they look better? Your rationale is simple causality: you like how a black car looks, so you purchase it. Okay, fair enough. But why do you like how the black car looks? Why do you prefer it being black? Simply saying because it looks better answers nothing.
 
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