Thoughts on J. Stokes talking football..

[Darth_Shiveman]

Anyone denying that Stokes has a lot of potential as a TE is crazy. With him as a TE, you can pretty much pencil in 3-4 plays a game in as "our 6'8" athletic TE is being covered by a 6' safety who is 60-70 LBs lighter: Let's throw the bomb about 12 feet up in the air and see who comes down with it."

Whether trying out football or sticking with basketball/going pro after this season is a completely different discussion, however.

 

[jp1]

If its anything like BBall, they would just double-team him on the go route and he'd freak out and drop the ball.

Yeah because he has done that a lot this year!

Next time think before you post.

 

[WoodsmanVol]

Anyone denying that Stokes has a lot of potential as a TE is crazy. With him as a TE, you can pretty much pencil in 3-4 plays a game in as "our 6'8" athletic TE is being covered by a 6' safety who is 60-70 LBs lighter: Let's throw the bomb about 12 feet up in the air and see who comes down with it."

Whether trying out football or sticking with basketball/going pro after this season is a completely different discussion, however.

Beg to differ. Stokes isn't in football shape, nor far as I know football experienced. Throw a bomb up into the air as suggested and you get 3 or more other DB converging on it. Two block out Stokes and one grabs or tips it ala Sherman of the Seahawks. Plus that 6' safety knows he needs not intercept the ball just prevent Stokes form catching it. So that 6' safety will likely have experience positioning his body, using his arms and hands, and even feet to simply break up the play. Now, if Stokes had long time football experience that's a different matter. He'd be a mismatch practically every play. Size may matter, but experience has its takers too. In college, I went up against a 200lbs wrestler when I was only 135lbs. I couldn't pin him but won on points. However, the win was removed when the embarrassed and peed off daddy griped the match was illegal due to size disadvantage. Funny, daddy didn't say anything when I went in so my team didn't automatically forfeit the points due to our guy being a no show. Of course it helped I was also a gymnast and as flexible as a rubber hose. Point is, Stokes size doesn't mean automatic success, especially in the SEC. Experienced DBs or safeties handle all kinds so an inexperienced TE won't scare them.

 

[LotteryPick]

Because I'm siding with common sense and lots of precedence. You, one the other hand, just come out and state matter of factly, without a single thing to base it on.

You can go to the NFL.com site and read the articles where Jimmy Graham, and now the early 1st Rd prospect, Mike Evans state clearly that their basketball experience gives them skills that transfer directly to the TE or WR position.

Stokes isn't as athletic as either of those guys.

It's simple, really:

We have TE's.

We don't have DL depth.

But since we're making inaccurate comparisons, Julius Peppers also played basketball.

 

[Give_All_Vol]

So what was actually said? Is there anything concrete that lead us to this topic or is it all speculation?

 

[HBCButch]

Know he would have good hands and leaping ability and size, not confident in the route running. Seen in the newspaper he ran like a 4.48 40. That's pretty impressive if true.

It's ridiculous unless he can back it up. Football players are a totally different breed. You're drawn to it. I've seen guys dismiss themselves after watching the contact. It's not just about athleticism. If you like very hard practices, hands hurting in the winter, don't mind major dinks to the body...football just might be for you. But if you're squemish in any way or form...you may want to stick to basketball or baseball. That's it in a nutshell. Some of us couldn't care less about athleticism. In my day I'd have hit you so hard it would've made your ancestors scream. I couldn't give a squat how big or athletic you are...I'll find you.

 

[devildog89]

Preaching to the choir HBC, been there done that. Played the 4 spot in basketball and quarterback all four years in high school. Just posting what the newspaper said. Sure he understands that too since he played football in high school as well.

 

[Darth_Shiveman]

Beg to differ. Stokes isn't in football shape, nor far as I know football experienced. Throw a bomb up into the air as suggested and you get 3 or more other DB converging on it. Two block out Stokes and one grabs or tips it ala Sherman of the Seahawks. Plus that 6' safety knows he needs not intercept the ball just prevent Stokes form catching it. So that 6' safety will likely have experience positioning his body, using his arms and hands, and even feet to simply break up the play. Now, if Stokes had long time football experience that's a different matter. He'd be a mismatch practically every play. Size may matter, but experience has its takers too. In college, I went up against a 200lbs wrestler when I was only 135lbs. I couldn't pin him but won on points. However, the win was removed when the embarrassed and peed off daddy griped the match was illegal due to size disadvantage. Funny, daddy didn't say anything when I went in so my team didn't automatically forfeit the points due to our guy being a no show. Of course it helped I was also a gymnast and as flexible as a rubber hose. Point is, Stokes size doesn't mean automatic success, especially in the SEC. Experienced DBs or safeties handle all kinds so an inexperienced TE won't scare them.

1. If 3 DBS are converging on it, then Stokes is triple covered and we should have others open

2. You anecdote has nothing to do with whether a 6' DB can beat an athletic 6'8 TE (who also happens to be the best rebounder in the SEC) for a jump ball in one on one coverage.

 

[PineyBluff Vol]

This may help some of you get over this little Pipe dream! John Prine : Spanish Pipedream (1985) - YouTube

 

[WoodsmanVol]

1. If 3 DBS are converging on it, then Stokes is triple covered and we should have others open

2. You anecdote has nothing to do with whether a 6' DB can beat an athletic 6'8 TE (who also happens to be the best rebounder in the SEC) for a jump ball in one on one coverage.

A. The premise was that the ball is already in the air heading for for Stokes on a ballistic arch. The fast DB in the SEC would converge on him with plenty of time to do so, a passing being thrown like that.


B. You'd be surprised what a 6' jumping jack very and long termed used to wearing pads, angling his body, and using the sneaky tricks they do. Just ask the jersey holding Gator DBs.

C. No need to get all holy about it. You got your view, I got mine,neither has been proven as yet. So there you have it. if the man really wants to play and makes the team, well. . . Vol Bless him!

==The Strategy for Stokes would be Mafian==

Mafia Underling:

Boss you don wanna order a hit.
Yeah, I know, there’s nothing faster than a bullet.
But you get 20 years to life in the penitentiary.
That’s absolutely and totally contrary;
To what you really, really oda do;
In getting rid of that thorn, Sal Santo.

Mob Boss:

We've got Tommy guns that fire thirty bullets at a clip.
We've got automatic rifles and a shotgun that's a pip.
A 90 year old hit man who shoots the thing from the hip.
He’s creaky, old, and slow, but nobody gives him any lip.

We got blackjacks and brass knuckles.
Detachable razor sharp belt buckles.
A surgeon who dismembers and chuckles.

Mafia Underling:

Ima tellin ya, boss best to frame old Sal Santo.
Find a crooked judge, a cop on the take, what’s mo;
I know a gun goes bang, bang, bang, it’s over inna minute
But there ain’t nuthin like a frame. You can put a picture in it.
Put it in a wall around glass, you got a window to enjoy the outside view a bit.
Boss, there ain’t nuthin like a frame. You can stand it up and install a door.
You can put it around your walls bottom edges when laying carpet on a floor.
Now picture old Sal Santo wearing not an Armani but black and white stripes.
Eating prison hog slop instead cannoli. Constantly nervous, taking little bites.
There ain’t nuthin, boss, there ain’t nothing like a frame.

Mob Boss:

I got it! I got an idea! Let’s frame Sal Santo!
Cause there ain’t nuthin and I mean nuthin like a frame.
Putting a hit on him? Bah! That’s old hat, just the same old thing.
But there ain’t nuthin, nuthin, there ain’t nuthin like a frame.
(Set to the music of There’s Nothing Like Dame)
South Pacific: There is Nothing Like A Dame - YouTube

 

[Darth_Shiveman]

A. The premise was that the ball is already in the air heading for for Stokes on a ballistic arch. The fast DB in the SEC would converge on him with plenty of time to do so, a passing being thrown like that.


B. You'd be surprised what a 6' jumping jack very and long termed used to wearing pads, angling his body, and using the sneaky tricks they do. Just ask the jersey holding Gator DBs.

C. No need to get all holy about it. You got your view, I got mine,neither has been proven as yet. So there you have it. if the man really wants to play and makes the team, well. . . Vol Bless him!

==The Strategy for Stokes would be Mafian==

Mafia Underling:

Boss you don wanna order a hit.
Yeah, I know, there’s nothing faster than a bullet.
But you get 20 years to life in the penitentiary.
That’s absolutely and totally contrary;
To what you really, really oda do;
In getting rid of that thorn, Sal Santo.

Mob Boss:

We've got Tommy guns that fire thirty bullets at a clip.
We've got automatic rifles and a shotgun that's a pip.
A 90 year old hit man who shoots the thing from the hip.
He’s creaky, old, and slow, but nobody gives him any lip.

We got blackjacks and brass knuckles.
Detachable razor sharp belt buckles.
A surgeon who dismembers and chuckles.

Mafia Underling:

Ima tellin ya, boss best to frame old Sal Santo.
Find a crooked judge, a cop on the take, what’s mo;
I know a gun goes bang, bang, bang, it’s over inna minute
But there ain’t nuthin like a frame. You can put a picture in it.
Put it in a wall around glass, you got a window to enjoy the outside view a bit.
Boss, there ain’t nuthin like a frame. You can stand it up and install a door.
You can put it around your walls bottom edges when laying carpet on a floor.
Now picture old Sal Santo wearing not an Armani but black and white stripes.
Eating prison hog slop instead cannoli. Constantly nervous, taking little bites.
There ain’t nuthin, boss, there ain’t nothing like a frame.

Mob Boss:

I got it! I got an idea! Let’s frame Sal Santo!
Cause there ain’t nuthin and I mean nuthin like a frame.
Putting a hit on him? Bah! That’s old hat, just the same old thing.
But there ain’t nuthin, nuthin, there ain’t nuthin like a frame.
(Set to the music of There’s Nothing Like Dame)
South Pacific: There is Nothing Like A Dame - YouTube

Really though, how often do 3 DBs converge on a pass? Any time that is possible, the QB either made the wrong read or a terrible pass (except for Hail Mary situations I guess).

I'm not saying stokes would automatically be an all sec player or anything, but denying that he has the physical tools to be a good TE is ridiculous.

At the very least, he'd get some looks and an opportunity to compete and see the field if he decided he wanted to play in the fall. He may not be in "football shape," but he's already proven himself as an SEC athlete, which is more than 1/3 of our roster (and virtually all of our TE depth next season) has done.

He probably wouldn't be physical enough in the blocking game for us, but if he's as fast as he claims, there's no denying he could be a matchup nightmare for defenses.

 

[WoodsmanVol]

Really though, how often do 3 DBs converge on a pass? Any time that is possible, the QB either made the wrong read or a terrible pass (except for Hail Mary situations I guess).

I'm not saying stokes would automatically be an all sec player or anything, but denying that he has the physical tools to be a good TE is ridiculous.

At the very least, he'd get some looks and an opportunity to compete and see the field if he decided he wanted to play in the fall. He may not be in "football shape," but he's already proven himself as an SEC athlete, which is more than 1/3 of our roster (and virtually all of our TE depth next season) has done.

He probably wouldn't be physical enough in the blocking game for us, but if he's as fast as he claims, there's no denying he could be a matchup nightmare for defenses.

Oh, I don't know, man. I think he'd find out fast that getting hit in football is nothing like basketball jostling. A 15+ mph field hit isn't close to the 5mph bumps you get on a court. The bruises last longer too. Knowhutinmen?

 

[Jones4theVols]

Beg to differ. Stokes isn't in football shape, nor far as I know football experienced. Throw a bomb up into the air as suggested and you get 3 or more other DB converging on it. Two block out Stokes and one grabs or tips it ala Sherman of the Seahawks. Plus that 6' safety knows he needs not intercept the ball just prevent Stokes form catching it. So that 6' safety will likely have experience positioning his body, using his arms and hands, and even feet to simply break up the play. Now, if Stokes had long time football experience that's a different matter. He'd be a mismatch practically every play. Size may matter, but experience has its takers too. In college, I went up against a 200lbs wrestler when I was only 135lbs. I couldn't pin him but won on points. However, the win was removed when the embarrassed and peed off daddy griped the match was illegal due to size disadvantage. Funny, daddy didn't say anything when I went in so my team didn't automatically forfeit the points due to our guy being a no show. Of course it helped I was also a gymnast and as flexible as a rubber hose. Point is, Stokes size doesn't mean automatic success, especially in the SEC. Experienced DBs or safeties handle all kinds so an inexperienced TE won't scare them.

I don't know how much high level basketball you have played but basketball shape translates well to football shape... And while Stokes may not be experienced at this level of football he has great size and is a really good rebounder, often against guys that are taller than him. He would have no problem high pointing the ball around short DB's, he does it 10+ times per basketball game against players his own height.

Fact is, no one knows if he would be any good. However, I think most would agree he has many of the required skills.

 

[WoodsmanVol]

I don't know how much high level basketball you have played but basketball shape translates well to football shape... And while Stokes may not be experienced at this level of football he has great size and is a really good rebounder, often against guys that are taller than him. He would have no problem high pointing the ball around short DB's, he does it 10+ times per basketball game against players his own height.

Fact is, no one knows if he would be any good. However, I think most would agree he has many of the required skills.

Could be. Let's see if he puts his money where his mouth is or not. Then we can have a real conversation about it.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

If he's actually going to play football, he needs to be at DE.

DL depth chart is brutal.

I get that, but Stokes wouldn't play at TE. Wolf and Helm have the same amount of experience (none) and seem to be impressing everyone.

We need all the athleticism we can get on DL. Having a guy that's ready, physically, would help too.

You are looking at it from a vantage point of what would help the football team. Stokes is looking at it from the vantage point of what would help him make money after UT. The 2 are completely conflicting positions.

 

[BruisedOrange]

Red zone (orange zone here).

All Stokes would need to do to have an IMPACT next season is be on the field when we have the ball inside the 10.

Stack 3 receivers to one side. If Stokes can learn to "rub" off a defender instead of pick--one of the three will be open every time.

Can he block and release at the goal line? Defenses will have to put a linebacker over him, and DBs will cheat to have an angle to break up the pass. That opens up a running lane and creates holes in the back of the end zone.

If next year Stokes was thrown only 10 passes, and had less than 100 yards receiving, he could easily score 38 points. (Math? I'm figuring one of those receptions to be a two-point conversion.)

My point is, he doesn't have to become an every-down TE next year to be a game changer. All he would need to do is develop a couple of specific play skills.

 

[Hamptonvolfan]

Know he would have good hands and leaping ability and size, not confident in the route running. Seen in the newspaper he ran like a 4.48 40. That's pretty impressive if true.

Stokes doesn't have any hops, of course most tight ends don't. Good hands though.

 

[Nuctech777]

Beg to differ. Stokes isn't in football shape, nor far as I know football experienced. Throw a bomb up into the air as suggested and you get 3 or more other DB converging on it. Two block out Stokes and one grabs or tips it ala Sherman of the Seahawks. Plus that 6' safety knows he needs not intercept the ball just prevent Stokes form catching it. So that 6' safety will likely have experience positioning his body, using his arms and hands, and even feet to simply break up the play. Now, if Stokes had long time football experience that's a different matter. He'd be a mismatch practically every play. Size may matter, but experience has its takers too. In college, I went up against a 200lbs wrestler when I was only 135lbs. I couldn't pin him but won on points. However, the win was removed when the embarrassed and peed off daddy griped the match was illegal due to size disadvantage. Funny, daddy didn't say anything when I went in so my team didn't automatically forfeit the points due to our guy being a no show. Of course it helped I was also a gymnast and as flexible as a rubber hose. Point is, Stokes size doesn't mean automatic success, especially in the SEC. Experienced DBs or safeties handle all kinds so an inexperienced TE won't scare them.

Is form catching kind of like form tackling?

 

[VOLorNuttin]

Stokes isn't as athletic as either of those guys.

Cause YOU say so? What could you possibly base that nonsense on? Oh, that's right. Your feeble opinion is fact in your mind. None of your opinons are EVER stated as such. :loco:

It's simple, really:

It's simple alright...you don't have a clue as to what you're talking about here.

We have TE's.

We have one broke TE who has yet to do much on this team...a few stop gap TE's that aren't SEC level players...and then a few freshmen that will take some time to develop.

We don't have DL depth.

We have plenty of depth at DE:
1) Corey Vereen
2) Jordan Williams
3) LaTroy Lewis
4) Jaylen Miller
5) Malik Brown
6) Dimarya Mixon

That's 3 deep....and not even including the incoming Freshman:
1) Derek Barnett
2) Dewayne Hendrix
3) Joe Henderson

That's 4 deep come fall...and Jason Carr may well play DE in running situations. Maggit will probably get some plays at DE, too.

But since we're making inaccurate comparisons, Julius Peppers also played basketball.

Inaccurate? There are FAR more BB players who were either a TE or BIG WR, than DL. It ain't even close.

College basketball stars in the NFL | NFL.com

 

[LotteryPick]

Cause YOU say so? What could you possibly base that nonsense on? Oh, that's right. Your feeble opinion is fact in your mind. None of your opinons are EVER stated as such. :loco:

It's simple alright...you don't have a clue as to what you're talking about here.

We have one broke TE who has yet to do much on this team...a few stop gap TE's that aren't SEC level players...and then a few freshmen that will take some time to develop.

We have plenty of depth at DE:
1) Corey Vereen
2) Jordan Williams
3) LaTroy Lewis
4) Jaylen Miller
5) Malik Brown
6) Dimarya Mixon

That's 3 deep....and not even including the incoming Freshman:
1) Derek Barnett
2) Dewayne Hendrix
3) Joe Henderson

That's 4 deep come fall...and Jason Carr may well play DE in running situations. Maggit will probably get some plays at DE, too.

Inaccurate? There are FAR more BB players who were either a TE or BIG WR, than DL. It ain't even close.

College basketball stars in the NFL | NFL.com

This is all really funny to me, because we're both basing things off opinions, but you're bashing me for mine.

So be it.

*insert rebuttal of you claiming your opinion isn't an opinion blah blah blah*

 

[LotteryPick]

You are looking at it from a vantage point of what would help the football team. Stokes is looking at it from the vantage point of what would help him make money after UT. The 2 are completely conflicting positions.

Understandable, but I don't think Stokes is playing, regardless, so none of this really matters.

 

[LotteryPick]

Cause YOU say so? What could you possibly base that nonsense on? Oh, that's right. Your feeble opinion is fact in your mind. None of your opinons are EVER stated as such. :loco:

It's simple alright...you don't have a clue as to what you're talking about here.

We have one broke TE who has yet to do much on this team...a few stop gap TE's that aren't SEC level players...and then a few freshmen that will take some time to develop.

We have plenty of depth at DE:
1) Corey Vereen
2) Jordan Williams
3) LaTroy Lewis
4) Jaylen Miller
5) Malik Brown
6) Dimarya Mixon

That's 3 deep....and not even including the incoming Freshman:
1) Derek Barnett
2) Dewayne Hendrix
3) Joe Henderson

That's 4 deep come fall...and Jason Carr may well play DE in running situations. Maggit will probably get some plays at DE, too.

Inaccurate? There are FAR more BB players who were either a TE or BIG WR, than DL. It ain't even close.

College basketball stars in the NFL | NFL.com

Btw, that's most unproven "depth" I've ever seen on DL.

 

[PrattvilleVol]

I saw that too but there is no way he ran a 4.48.

If you've ever run wide open against a very tall guy like JS, you will quickly realize what a small, slow person you are as his one stride equals three of your pitter pats and you watch him leave you in a pile of dust.

 

[white65]

Not many 6'8 PFs in the NBA but there not many people that rebound like stokes.

 

[kenrblan]

Not many 6'8 PFs in the NBA but there not many people that rebound like stokes.

Kenneth Faried is probably the best current NBA player comparison, but Faried looks quicker with better jumping ability.