Vaccine or not?

#5,901
#5,901
VolStrom said:
When I was working my company had a two tiered rate for tobacco users vs non-tobacco users for health insurance. They also had employees sign a statement that they knew they would be fired for falsifying the tobacco use statement. I never heard of anyone being fired over it though.
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I haven't seen it happen either but I have seen plenty of claims being denied for it, and I've never even been involved in claims. Sounds like a nightmare of a department.
 
#5,902
#5,902
C-south said:
I know BCBS charged an extra fee for smokers but I’ve never heard of an actual company mandate such a thing. It was even on the “honor system” Does delta operate their own health insurance company? Next thing you know companies will be able to discriminate against minorities, trannies, atheists, etc.
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Self insured. We're woke so I highly doubt we would do any of those things you mentioned.
 
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#5,904
#5,904
RockyTop85 said:
It doesn’t matter. I pay when I eat at Olive Garden, it doesn’t mean I get to go in the back and **** in their bottomless salad.

If I rent an office space or an apartment, it doesn’t mean I get to smoke inside or spray paint the outside of the building.

Public property is subject to the rules agreed upon by the majority.
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It is not always a majority Chief. If you truly believe so, I hope you return to consciousness before it's too late.
 
#5,905
#5,905
LouderVol said:
Which is what I said. That *there is* steps and processes for them to do what they want.

Some rando FAA upper middle management dude decides no Smith's, Martin's, Johnsons can fly. He is free to do that. He is also free to get fired. And the next guy is free to undo it.

It's the same principle you are applying to individuals. They are free to make choices and face the consquences.
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I guess I’m confused. This isn’t Rando dude at FAA, it’s a bill being passed through Congress. So if it makes it through the Senate then it got at least 60 votes and it’s not even majority rule.

FAA dude has to abide by the administrative procedures act, which, since the last DACA case, basically means he needs unanimous consent of every judge or panel in America.
 
#5,906
#5,906
Everyone that worked for delta the past year and a half before there was an approved vaccine should sue their ass. Especially the ones that actually contracted Covid. Hell retroactively pay all of their employees at least an extra $200 a week, month,…whatever.
 
#5,907
#5,907
SpaceCoastVol said:
It is not always a majority Chief. If you truly believe so, I hope you return to consciousness before it's too late.
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That’s right. There are specific instances where imajority rule isn’t good enough. They were agreed upon in advance.

Regulation of the use of the commons isn’t one of them.
 
#5,909
#5,909
RockyTop85 said:
I guess I’m confused. This isn’t Rando dude at FAA, it’s a bill being passed through Congress. So if it makes it through the Senate then it got at least 60 votes and it’s not even majority rule.

FAA dude has to abide by the administrative procedures act, which, since the last DACA case, basically means he needs unanimous consent of every judge or panel in America.
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The language in that bill is what's going to matter. Not sure if this thread or other, but carrot vs stick makes a huge difference for me.
 
#5,910
#5,910
Ttucke11 said:
So mine asked me if I was a tobacco user, I am not. I do however vape large amounts of nicotine. It never asked about that. Would they test for nicotine? Seems like some BS if they denied a claim I had due to that.
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Thank God there's no long term side effects to vaping
 
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#5,911
#5,911
phoenixvol said:
Here's another pre-print out of Israel that may interest those that have natural immunity.
Comparing SARS-CoV-2 natural immunity to vaccine-induced immunity: reinfections versus breakthrough infections
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Thanks for posting this. What is striking looking at the tables is that the risk of breakthrough compared to reinfection is really being driven in those 60 or older. Wonder why the vaccine wears off so much quickly in those 60 or older. Maybe comorbidities. Anyways it appears that those who got infected and received just 1 shot had almost 50% reduced risk of reinfection compared to those prior infected. Wish we would focus more research on those who just may need 1 shot. Maybe just those over 60 need boosters.
This country should really refocus on including those with confirmed prior infection as having immunity at least for the short term and actively monitor them to see how long immunity may last. Think they would convince more people to consider getting at least 1 shot in those who are skeptical about the vaccine.
 
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#5,915
#5,915
Outbreak of SARS-CoV-2 Infections, Including COVID-19 Vaccine Breakthrough Infections, Associated with Large Public Gatherings — Barnstable County, Massachusetts, July 2021

Highlights from the link above:

"Among the 469 cases in Massachusetts residents, 346 (74%) occurred in persons who were fully vaccinated; of these, 301 (87%) were male, with a median age of 42 years. Vaccine products received by persons experiencing breakthrough infections were Pfizer-BioNTech (159; 46%), Moderna (131; 38%), and Janssen (56; 16%); among fully vaccinated persons in the Massachusetts general population, 56% had received Pfizer-BioNTech, 38% had received Moderna, and 7% had received Janssen vaccine products. Among persons with breakthrough infection, 274 (79%) reported signs or symptoms, with the most common being cough, headache, sore throat, myalgia, and fever. Among fully vaccinated symptomatic persons, the median interval from completion of ≥14 days after the final vaccine dose to symptom onset was 86 days (range = 6–178 days). Among persons with breakthrough infection, four (1.2%) were hospitalized, and no deaths were reported. Real-time RT-PCR Ct values in specimens from 127 fully vaccinated patients (median = 22.77) were similar to those among 84 patients who were unvaccinated, not fully vaccinated, or whose vaccination status was unknown (median = 21.54) (Figure 2)."

mm7031e2-F1.gif
 
#5,917
#5,917
LouderVol said:
Good. Shouldnt treat people different based on vaccine status.
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You’re insane if you think it won’t be a factor.
If there’s one bed available and they have to decide between a vaccinated patient and an unvaccinated patient it will go to the vaccinated every time.
And nobody will know anything about it.
 
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#5,920
#5,920
SlipKidVol said:
I had barometric done at work yesterday, I am 6'1" and weigh 183 dressed (always been skinny but have lost a few pounds during hot months) and my BMI = 24

dont get it
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It’s a terrible measurement in that sense. Did mine a week ago or so and I was like 24 (which was the high end of normal) at 5’10 163; 25+ was considered “overweight” I believe. Something like weighing 145 lbs. put me right in the middle of normal. Can’t imagine weighing 145 lbs and what I would look like.
 
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#5,921
#5,921
SlipKidVol said:
I had barometric done at work yesterday, I am 6'1" and weigh 183 dressed (always been skinny but have lost a few pounds during hot months) and my BMI = 24

dont get it
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It’s a terrible measurement in that sense. Did mine a week ago or so and I was like 24 (which was the high end of normal) at 5’10 163; 25+ was considered “overweight” I believe. Something like weighing 145 put me right in the middle of normal.
 
#5,923
#5,923
mad4vols said:
Delta Air Lines announces that unvaccinated employees will need to pay a $200 per month surcharge for health insurance to cover the added risk. Who thinks all companies should do the same?
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It's no different than smoking/non smoking tiers or if you shop for life insurance (healthy or no)

Biggest question is the $200 a reasonable surcharge or a made up number to try to force vaccination. At first blush, it seems high.
 
#5,924
#5,924
BigOrangeMojo said:
It's no different than smoking/non smoking tiers or if you shop for life insurance (healthy or no)

Biggest question is the $200 a reasonable surcharge or a made up number to try to force vaccination. At first blush, it seems high.
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Another question would be whether employees who have recovered from infection and have serological evidence of immunity will be forced to pay extra, despite having the best proof of protection.
 
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#5,925
#5,925
kiddiedoc said:
Another question would be whether employees who have recovered from infection and have serological evidence of immunity will be forced to pay extra, despite having the best proof of protection.
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Also, if you have recently come down with you are advised to wait before getting the vaccine. Are those folks supposed to pay while being advised to not get it? I think one of my employees told me he was advised to wait 8 weeks? Something like that.
 
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