Vaccine or not?

[hog88]

I didn’t go look up the laws called out. From my understanding the EO parallels the legislation in front of the TX legislators so what he did is just roll it on early since companies are already flexing their statist muscles here. The vax blocking legislation will pass in TX it just has to work thru the state house. This just gives people piece of mind till it does. I haven’t seen my ******* company’s reply to it yet but I’m sure the statist bastards are disappointed

So let me get this straight, it's now statist to support private companies setting their own policies on employment?

It's hard to keep up with all the changes these days.

 

[LouderVol]

I didn’t go look up the laws called out. From my understanding the EO parallels the legislation in front of the TX legislators so what he did is just roll it on early since companies are already flexing their statist muscles here. The vax mandate blocking legislation will pass in TX it just has to work thru the state house. This just gives people piece of mind till it does. I haven’t seen my ******* company’s reply to it yet but I’m sure the statist bastards are disappointed

Cheering statism while booing statism. What a twisted world.

Like I said it goes back to what is being suspended. If it just impacts a bunch of state government groups who derive their power from the governors desk, then fine. But if it is suspending legislation that's different.

 

[VolinWayne]

Can you elaborate on what "rights" are conveyed to an employee merely by being employed?

The right to be able to choose to not inject your body with a vaccination thats had far to many adverse reactions without the fear of loosing their jobs. I have a problem with that. Admittedly, I would expect you to think that's completely normal. Many of these businesses have been pushed by the train wreck that's in office to mandate these policies. I see nothing wrong for them to now be pushed in the opposite direction.

 

[LouderVol]

Never underestimate a persons willingness to dump on the democratic legislative process they claim to revere if they personally disagree with the final product.

This is why I say two sides of the same coin. Neither party really cares, they just want their ideologies pushed regardless of consquences, or means or methods.

 

[NorthDallas40]

What are the laws he is suspending? I like the general idea of this, but I dont like executive actions that unilaterally suspend laws.

Now if they are laws on executive powers that becomes an interesting situation.

I looked this up and found the explanation relating to his previous EO targeted at government workers only. It looks like it just points to the code chapters which empower state officials to act so he just removed the power of state officials to act on vax mandates. Basically it would be the result of the bill in front of the state house.

Texas Government Code - GOV'T § 418.1015 | FindLaw

<By executive order, Governor Abbott suspended V.T.C.A., Government Code §§ 418.1015(b) and 418.108 to the extent necessary to preclude any county judge or mayor of a municipality, or any emergency management director, from releasing persons under any circumstances inconsistent with Texas Executive Order 13 (GA-13).

 

[hog88]

The right to be able to choose to not inject your body with a vaccination thats had far to many adverse reactions without the fear of loosing their jobs. I have a problem with that. Admittedly, I would expect you to think that's completely normal. Many of these businesses have been pushed by the train wreck that's in office to mandate these policies. I see nothing wrong for them to now be pushed in the opposite direction.

Employees have the right to find other employment.

 

[LouderVol]

The right to be able to choose to not inject your body with a vaccination thats had far to many adverse reactions without the fear of loosing their jobs. I have a problem with that. Admittedly, I would expect you to think that's completely normal. Many of these businesses have been pushed by the train wreck that's in office to mandate these policies. I see nothing wrong for them to now be pushed in the opposite direction.

That's the wrong direction to take.

It's more the business is completely rewriting the terms of employment without input from the employed during a term of employment. Shouldnt be able to change the "contract" without input, imo. No idea what specific state laws say on the matter.

If the place of employment never required vaccination of other diseases before, imo, they dont have a leg to stand on to require it now for Covid for existing employees. Now if they want to dictate vaccinations for new employees that's different.

 

[NorthDallas40]

So let me get this straight, it's now statist to support private companies setting their own policies on employment?

It's hard to keep up with all the changes these days.

No. It is statist for a company to impose health choices on individuals mandated by the federal ass hats. Biden has no power over individual citizens which is why he tried this end around using OSHA. It’s absolutely statist and over reach to force these mandates without reasonable accommodation like optimal weekly testing.

 

[LouderVol]

I looked this up and found the explanation relating to his previous EO targeted at government workers only. It looks like it just points to the code chapters which empower state officials to act so he just removed the power of state officials to act on vax mandates. Basically it would be the result of the bill in front of the state house.

Texas Government Code - GOV'T § 418.1015 | FindLaw

Then let the legislation happen. No need to jump the line.

 

[NorthDallas40]

That's the wrong direction to take.

It's more the business is completely rewriting the terms of employment without input from the employed during a term of employment. Shouldnt be able to change the "contract" without input, imo. No idea what specific state laws say on the matter.

If the place of employment never required vaccination of other diseases before, imo, they dont have a leg to stand on to require it now for Covid for existing employees. Now if they want to dictate vaccinations for new employees that's different.

Agreed. Which is what my asshat company did.

 

[NorthDallas40]

Then let the legislation happen. No need to jump the line.

We disagree I guess then. This was forced due to the timeline. The legislation wouldn’t kick in until after the idiot in chief’s mandate on Jan 1. So you would wind up with legislation passed but not in effect yet while federal over reach is in effect and effecting people’s livelihoods. In this case it provides consistency and removes stress on Texans that wasn’t warranted

 

[NorthDallas40]

Cheering statism while booing statism. What a twisted world.

Like I said it goes back to what is being suspended. If it just impacts a bunch of state government groups who derive their power from the governors desk, then fine. But if it is suspending legislation that's different.

It isn’t statism. Read my last reply to you. It restores individual choice and provides a consistent timeline. Frankly I think it’s what every Governor should do. Statism would be to remove individual choice which is what the idiot in chief wanted to do.

 

[LouderVol]

We disagree I guess then. This was forced due to the timeline. The legislation wouldn’t kick in until after the idiot in chief’s mandate on Jan 1. So you would wind up with legislation passed but not in effect yet while federal over reach is in effect and effecting people’s livelihoods. In this case it provides consistency and removes stress on Texans that wasn’t warranted

Then get a judge to step in. Injunctions are what they are called I believe. Pretty standard fair for matters of timing as I understand it.

 

[LouderVol]

It isn’t statism. Read my last reply to you. It restores individual choice and provides a consistent timeline. Frankly I think it’s what every Governor should do. Statism would be to remove individual choice which is what the idiot in chief wanted to do.

But this is statism of ignoring established protocols. The governor giving himself power. Doesnt matter if it's for the right cause. Bad done in the name of good does not become good.

 

[Fun coupon VOL]

Thank god Dr Gottlieb who sits on the board for Pfizer and Illumina doesn’t think governors should be able to block vaccine mandates.

I wouldn’t know who to trust if it wasn’t for him, ya know the guy getting paid hundreds of thousand if not millions of dollars by Pfizer.

Also 53 seconds in let’s you know where this guy is.

 

[NorthDallas40]

Then get a judge to step in. Injunctions are what they are called I believe. Pretty standard fair for matters of timing as I understand it.

That isn’t the only course of action and the EO is the appropriate response for the Texas legislation implementation timeline.

 

[NorthDallas40]

But this is statism of ignoring established protocols. The governor giving himself power. Doesnt matter if it's for the right cause. Bad done in the name of good does not become good.

No it isn’t. He’s acting within his power to insure a consistent legislation enaction timeline. This is exactly what a very large number of Texans were hoping would happen based on the likely timeline of events that would have unfolded.

• Texas house passes legislation mirrored by the EO but it takes a minimum of 90 days to go into effect.
• OSHA actually puts draconian rules in place that the Biden EO wanted.
• Companies take employment action against employees based in the new OSHA regs
• Those regs OSHA regs become moot once the previously passed legislation goes into effect.

 

[jaybird_1981]

Employees have the right to find other employment.

Entire industries are mandating vaccinations. It isn't quite that simple this time.

 

[NorthDallas40]

Employees have the right to find other employment.

Employers changing the terms of employment mid course and adversely impacting employees income is idiocy and complete bull ****. I don’t care if they make changes going forward for new employees but making changes like this retroactive is stupid as hell

 

[hog88]

No. It is statist for a company to impose health choices on individuals mandated by the federal ass hats. Biden has no power over individual citizens which is why he tried this end around using OSHA. It’s absolutely statist and over reach to force these mandates without reasonable accommodation like optimal weekly testing.

Is it statist to impose some of the ridiculous PPE requirements OSHA has imposed? Is it statist to force CDL drivers to follow the hours of service regulations imposed on them by the DOT?

Businesses are caught between a rock and a hard place, stand up to the federal .gov and take the chance of paying hefty fines AND then still have to impose the mandate should the courts rule against them? Hell no! No CEO or individual owner of a company big enough to be impacted by this mandate is going to do that, it would be fiduciary malfeasance.

You're also ignoring how this mandate by Abbot is stepping on the rights of business owners to set their own employment policies. What if they want to require vaccinations, doesn't the owner have the right to do so or should he be forced to bake the cake?

 

[hog88]

It isn’t statism. Read my last reply to you. It restores individual choice and provides a consistent timeline. Frankly I think it’s what every Governor should do. Statism would be to remove individual choice which is what the idiot in chief wanted to do.

Anti-Statism would be the governor announcing the federal mandate would not be enforced in Texas. His mandate is just as statist as Biden's is.

 

[hog88]

Entire industries are mandating vaccinations. It isn't quite that simple this time.

Yes it is.

How long do you think this mandate would go on if even 1/2 of airline employees just say nope? I can tell you truckers are saying nope by the truckload and when the trucks stop so does this country.

 

[NorthDallas40]

Is it statist to impose some of the ridiculous PPE requirements OSHA has imposed? Is it statist to force CDL drivers to follow the hours of service regulations imposed on them by the DOT?

Businesses are caught between a rock and a hard place, stand up to the federal .gov and take the chance of paying hefty fines AND then still have to impose the mandate should the courts rule against them? Hell no! No CEO or individual owner of a company big enough to be impacted by this mandate is going to do that, it would be fiduciary malfeasance.

You're also ignoring how this mandate by Abbot is stepping on the rights of business owners to set their own employment policies. What if they want to require vaccinations, doesn't the owner have the right to do so or should he be forced to bake the cake?

No idea you know more about that that I do. But I wouldn’t be shocked to find out you’re right.

And I know more about this legislation timeline in Texas than you do as I’ve watched it like a Hawk for months. Abbott’s EO wouldn’t have been needed without Biden’s overreach EO which wrongly attempts to extend the power of the federal executive office over individual citizens. There are all kinds of legal opinions stating that’s exactly what he did. All Abbott’s EO does is insure a consistent legislative rollout and fact the EO explicitly states its authority ends when the current legislation in debate place goes into place.

 

[hog88]

No idea you know more about that that I do. But I wouldn’t be shocked to find out you’re right.

And I know more about this legislation timeline in Texas than you do as I’ve watched it like a Hawk for months. Abbott’s EO wouldn’t have been needed without Biden’s overreach EO which wrongly attempts to extend the power of the federal executive office over individual citizens. There are all kinds of legal opinions stating that’s exactly what he did. All Abbott’s EO does is insure a consistent legislative rollout and fact the EO explicitly states its authority ends when the current legislation in debate place goes into place.

Even legislation passed by the legislature is statist since it takes the power away to set employment practices.

 

[NorthDallas40]

Anti-Statism would be the governor announcing the federal mandate would not be enforced in Texas. His mandate is just as statist as Biden's is.

Nope again. Abbott’s EO insures consistency in legislation rollout and barrs the overreach of the federal executive office. Go read my reply to louder on why many Texans wanted this temporary EO which is all it is. It insures a smooth Texas legislation rollout on this topic.