War in Ukraine

[AM64]

Only the "looney tunes leftists?" There is a Putin loving, pro Russia faction in base of the Republican Party, because he is racist/fascist, and they are racists/fascists.

Yeah, well you are getting too much of your news from the single wing (left) media. They try hard (bless their pea pickin' hearts) to alienate through slander, innuendo, omission of truth anyone they see as an obstacle to their agenda.

 

[AM64]

Every single democrat voted to send weapons to neo Nazis in Ukraine. Now please tell us again which party is racist/fascist.

It was also a democrat activist posing as a journalist over at the NY Times writing a racist article on Mayra Flores. You all aren't very accepting of the fact that many Hispanics are voting Republican now. By the way. I've heard what you guys say in private when it comes to Clarence Thomas, Tim Scott, Ben Carson and Candace Owens. Which is one of the reasons I don't hang out with much of your crowd anymore.

No. Every single dem voted to spend money under the guise of Ukrainian support. You have to follow the money to find the real crime as usual. Dems are masters of deceit when it comes to spending, what a bill is supposedly for, and where the money really goes.

 

[AM64]

Anybody in his right mind should see a place like Russia as too vast for a real land war. It's that vastness, the winters, and so on that would stretch logistics to the breaking point and prohibit the security necessary to keep advancing. It's the kind of place, that despite victories, will swallow armies whole. Eisenhower had a reason for warning against land wars in Asia.

 

[AM64]

What are we gaining with the money and material being sent?

Like it or not the US, Russia, and China are the three big powers right now, and we are at odds with two of them - and should be. China and Russia attempt worldwide instability and have been doing so for decades. If we can weaken them without a fight of our own, it's a win. We've somehow gained too much "of that lovin' feeling" since the Cold War supposedly became a thing of the past. You are really looking more at a timeout for the other two to get their acts together. The only good news is that while China is building a war machine, Russia is looking inept - but still bent on putting the old Soviet pieces back together again. The bad news is that with nuclear arsenals, either can do incredible worldwide damage; so despite incompetence in some areas, neither is going to just fade away - but they could overplay their hand and face regime change because of issues like the invasion of Ukraine.

 

[AM64]

Anyone with common sense should have known this would happen. Of course LNG shipped across the Atlantic is going to be more expensive than Russian pipeline gas. So instead of the "threat" of Russia using energy as a tool of blackmail and control, it is the US that is engaging in it. They destroyed the Nordstream pipelines that would have been available as an escape route out of these silly azz sanctions, but now, they are at the mercy of the US. Just dumb. Also, from what I understand, these gas purchases of American LNG are on the spot market. So you are also at the mercy of the spot price at that moment vs signing a long term gas contract with the Russians for cheaper and more reliable pipeline gas.

Macron Lashes Out At United States Over Double Standard Energy Policies

To compensate for its declining nuclear fleet and Russia’s complete halt of natural gas shipments into the country, France has turned to the United States for LNG—only Macron is unhappy with the price it’s paying.

U.S. natural gas exports to France increased 421% during the first eight months of 2022—but the value of that LNG increased by 1094% in August alone due to the higher prices of LNG.

So rather than whine and complain the French should have held the line on nuclear power and tried to do something to tame OPEC, an out of control global commodities market, and the nutty save the world environmental fascists. Overreliance on Russian gas was always going to bite Europe in the azz.

 

[volgr]

Hang on Larry I’ve seen you stooges drop RT and other Russia state media links claiming Russia was already fighting NATO directly. Even today there was reference to “western boots on the ground” in the conflict. FFS at least try to stay consistent with your bill

The West is involved and Russia is fighting a NATO proxy war in Ukraine, but western boots aren't on the ground...outside of some mercs.

 

[hog88]

Like it or not the US, Russia, and China are the three big powers right now, and we are at odds with two of them - and should be. China and Russia attempt worldwide instability and have been doing so for decades. If we can weaken them without a fight of our own, it's a win. We've somehow gained too much "of that lovin' feeling" since the Cold War supposedly became a thing of the past. You are really looking more at a timeout for the other two to get their acts together. The only good news is that while China is building a war machine, Russia is looking inept - but still bent on putting the old Soviet pieces back together again. The bad news is that with nuclear arsenals, either can do incredible worldwide damage; so despite incompetence in some areas, neither is going to just fade away - but they could overplay their hand and face regime change because of issues like the invasion of Ukraine.

The way to weaken Russia is the US producing and exporting more oil, that is almost their entire economy. We don't need to spend trillions of our tax dollars to drive them into irrelevancy.

 

[volgr]

Alaska was purchased from Russia. Bought and paid for so Russia has no claim.

Correct.

 

[AM64]

The way to weaken Russia is the US producing and exporting more oil, that is almost their entire economy. We don't need to spend trillions of our tax dollars to drive them into irrelevancy.

True, and apparently our own corporations were helping Russia with their oil and NG resources - you have to bet on the Europeans, too, as helping Russia develop and export. Russia still has a lot of other resources; they like the US can be self sufficient where a lot of countries have to rely on import/export. It's why for now the US, Russia, and China are in a league of our own - we at least for the time being have or had the lead because of our past industrial and agricultural history which new generations seem to despise. The EU is basically a way for Europe to try and be in the game since those individual countries are no longer colonial empires and lack the resources to be self sufficient.

 

[LouderVol]

Okay. Tell us why our current president and John McCain met with the leader of the neo Nazi Svoboda Party back in 2012 and 2014? Were they just fans? John McCain even stood next to him on stage when he was giving a speech.

I swear you guys will do anything to justify this proxy war.

They probably met dozens of Ukrainian politicians. Doesnt prove anything, even though I have no issue believing any and/or all of our politicians are dirty.

And I love how you continue to ignore that the Svodoba/Freedom party went from 37 parliament members under Yanukoych in 2012, to 1 parliament member under Zelensky in 2019. THEY WERE MORE NAZI UNDER THE GUY YOU MOURN THAN THEY ARE NOW.

Political parties in Ukraine - Wikipedia

 

[LouderVol]

Yep, just when Ukraine forces are at their weakest and Russia is at their strongest thus far in the conflict, bringing in 300K more troops...that is when they will decide to false flag a dirty bomb, according to the people in this thread who have been completely wrong throughout this conflict. Shocker.

Ukraine was in a far weaker position at the start. And Russias 300k havent even been fully scraped out of whatever gulag they are in, yet alone becoming an effective fighting force capable of changing the war, or even been fully deployed to the war zone.

Russia is pulling out all the stops right now.

 

[Orangeburst]

Anybody in his right mind should see a place like Russia as too vast for a real land war. It's that vastness, the winters, and so on that would stretch logistics to the breaking point and prohibit the security necessary to keep advancing. It's the kind of place, that despite victories, will swallow armies whole. Eisenhower had a reason for warning against land wars in Asia.

If NATO could not win in Russia..Russia could not win in NATO.
Why are we even having this "invasion" discussion anyways?

 

[AM64]

You think Ukraine is going to take recently annexed portions of Russia? Are you delusional?

Annexation is brute use of force to take land not belonging to you. Are you saying that in this day of "diplomacy" that military force is still an acceptable means of acquiring land? That "recently annexed portion of Russia" is Ukrainian land - not Russian land. There is a treaty between Ukraine and Russia agreed to by both sides - including Putin.

Treaty between Ukraine and the Russian Federation on the Ukrainian-Russian State border

 

[hog88]

True, and apparently our own corporations were helping Russia with their oil and NG resources - you have to bet on the Europeans, too, as helping Russia develop and export. Russia still has a lot of other resources; they like the US can be self sufficient where a lot of countries have to rely on import/export. It's why for now the US, Russia, and China are in a league of our own - we at least for the time being have or had the lead because of our past industrial and agricultural history which new generations seem to despise. The EU is basically a way for Europe to try and be in the game since those individual countries are no longer colonial empires and lack the resources to be self sufficient.

Russia is severely lacking the brain power, infrastructure and work ethic to fully exploit their own resources. I know an engineer who worked oil production in the Sakhalin islands back in the late 90s early 2000s, they had to import labor because the natives were too lazy and uneducated.

 

[AM64]

If NATO could not win in Russia..Russia could not win in NATO.
Why are we even having this "invasion" discussion anyways?

Good question, but it does come up from time to time. My point is that it would be an absurd thing to even attempt. Invading a country like Russia or China isn't even like eating an elephant one bite at a time. Russia can't conquer Ukraine which is a much smaller piece of land. We didn't tame either Afghanistan or a much smaller Vietnam. These days invasions of countries who don't want what you are selling is like the hand in the bucket of water - you don't really hold it and when the hand comes out it's like nothing changed. Of course, some places replace water in the bucket with acid and your hand just dissolves.

 

[AM64]

Russia is severely lacking the brain power, infrastructure and work ethic to fully exploit their own resources. I know an engineer who worked oil production in the Sakhalin islands back in the late 90s early 2000s, they had to import labor because the natives were too lazy and uneducated.

It's been that way for a very long time. During the days of the Russian Empire, Russia needed outside help from places like France to try and claw a way into the perhaps even the 19th century. One thing the Soviets did was develop some effective education that went largely for military application, but that seems to be the high point of their backward ways. Basically if Russia had been any kind of developed nation, communism wouldn't have happened. You can't sell communism to a country that's working.

 

[volgr]

Much like with McCarthy, when the Ukraine funding bill comes up, it is very likely most of these Dems will vote for it...but I guess it is a baby step in the right direction.

 

[volgr]

Ukraine was in a far weaker position at the start. And Russias 300k havent even been fully scraped out of whatever gulag they are in, yet alone becoming an effective fighting force capable of changing the war, or even been fully deployed to the war zone.

Total nonsense. Russia is pulling up 300k former combat trained soldiers. No different than the US. These forces will not require much time to train before being battle ready. As for Ukraine being weaker to start the war, that is ludicrous. Ukraine's best fighting forces, trained by NATO, are gone at this point and they aren't being replenished with former combat trained reinforcements. They are the ones, not Russia, being reinforced with barely trained conscripts. Which is why you see them taking HUGE losses in these poorly designed offensives in Kherson.

 

[hog88]

Much like with McCarthy, when the Ukraine funding bill comes up, it is very likely most of these Dems will vote for it...but I guess it is a baby step in the right direction.

Looks like some people aren't getting their kickbacks.

 

[hog88]

Total nonsense. Russia is pulling up 300k former combat trained soldiers. No different than the US. These forces will not require much time to train before being battle ready. As for Ukraine being weaker to start the war, that is ludicrous. Ukraine's best fighting forces, trained by NATO, are gone at this point and they aren't being replenished with former combat trained reinforcements. They are the ones, not Russia, being reinforced with barely trained conscripts. Which is why you see them taking HUGE losses in these poorly designed offensives in Kherson.

LOL

 

[Velo Vol]

@Rasputin_Vol do you agree with the Squad here?

 

[Septic]

LOL

Your honor, I'd like to enter that post into the record as proof of his idiocy.

300k battle tested russian Soldiers should have this war wrapped up in a minute.

 

[Orangeburst]

Much like with McCarthy, when the Ukraine funding bill comes up, it is very likely most of these Dems will vote for it...but I guess it is a baby step in the right direction.

All I ever asked for is keeping dialogue open.
If we are adamant on Regime Change..we might be facing WW3

 

[Septic]

@Rasputin_Vol do you agree with the Squad here?

Insert that button pushing meme of @Rasputin_Vol having to either agree with spineless dem pussys like Raskin, AOC and Turban Chick™ or................ Joe.


LOL, choose wisely.

 

[Septic]

All I ever asked for is keeping dialogue open.
If we are adamant on Regime Change..we might be facing WW3

I think what everyone is adamant about, is getting Russia to leave Ukraine and its stolen territory.

<checks papers>

Yep. This could all end if they'd just leave.