What is wrong with socialized medicine?

#52
#52
kptvol said:
Also, you can't see your doctor in the Summer, the month of December, weekends, Labor Day, or after 3pm. If you have poor behavior, your doctor will punish you by taking your temperature rectally.
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:lolabove: Had to laugh at that one.
 
#53
#53
kiddiedoc said:
That is completely dependent on the provider. There are many outstanding family practitioners.
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I'm sure there are. And they obviously do it for the moral rewards. Just like outstanding public school teachers.
 
#54
#54
UT IE 95 said:
I respect medical and education providers immensely. As a nation we provide free education. If someone has the means they can choose to seek alternate means from the government provided education system. The same system should work for the medical field as well.
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If you think that you receive the same quality of care at the health department as you would in a well-qualified private practice, then you are (again) extremely misinformed.
 
#55
#55
UT IE 95 said:
I'm sure there are. And they obviously do it for the moral rewards. Just like outstanding public school teachers.
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That's not at all the case. Reimbursement rates for visit and procedure codes for FPs and Internists should not differ. That's a misconception.
 
#56
#56
kiddiedoc said:
If you think that you receive the same quality of care at the health department as you would in a well-qualified private practice, then you are (again) extremely misinformed.
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You mean a doctor that devoted 11 years of his life to studying medicine would provide crappy care at the health department?
 
#57
#57
UT IE 95 said:
Doctors and teachers are cut from the same cloth. We think doctors that aren't pampered and paid ridiculous amounts of money will provide poor care. Yet we crap on the education providers and for some reason millions still show up and do a good job every day.
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Unbelievable comment...

Doctors spend years trying to master a trade that will end up saving lives. Sure, there are some bad seeds out there, but for the most part, they are here to save lives.

Teachers don't spend near as much time in school learning their trade and don't have people's lives in their hands. Their futures, yes... but their lives, not so.
 
#59
#59
Rasputin_Vol said:
Unbelievable comment...

Doctors spend years trying to master a trade that will end up saving lives. Sure, there are some bad seeds out there, but for the most part, they are here to save lives.

Teachers don't spend near as much time in school learning their trade and don't have people's lives in their hands. Their futures, yes... but their lives, not so.
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So learning how to communicate effectively isn't as important as diagnosing that rash on my elbow? Right. Everyone that goes to a doctor is not on death's doorstep.
 
#61
#61
UT IE 95 said:
You mean a doctor that devoted 11 years of his life to studying medicine would provide crappy care at the health department?
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No, but many HDs are run primarily by nurses or NPs with an overseeing physician, who often has other duties, as well. The HD is designed to provide immediate care to those without other means to a primary care provider. They are not meant to replace a dedicated clinic for most.
 
#62
#62
UT IE 95 said:
So learning how to communicate effectively isn't as important as diagnosing that rash on my elbow? Right. Everyone that goes to a doctor is not on death's doorstep.
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Learning how to communicate effectively is something I can teach a 6th grader. Understanding the cellular activity involved in a type I hypersensitivity reaction is a tad more challenging.
 
#63
#63
UT IE 95 said:
I fully endorse this post.
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So do I. Not unlike any other professions. Some people make C's while others make A's.

I still see your original point is rather absurd and think you are just stirring the pot out of boredom.
 
#64
#64
UT IE 95 said:
I respect medical and education providers immensely. As a nation we provide free education. If someone has the means they can choose to seek alternate means from the government provided education system. The same system should work for the medical field as well.
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Yeah, "if they have the means". Meanwhile, the gov't still takes their money even if they choose not to use the gov't funded school and support private schools, while those that do not have the means are trapped in public school.

The same would be true if you socialized medicine. Those with the means would avoid it if it is possible, where the lower and middle classes are left with sub-par health care choices.

Great analogy...
 
#65
#65
kiddiedoc said:
No, but many HDs are run primarily by nurses or NPs with an overseeing physician, who often has other duties, as well. The HD is designed to provide immediate care to those without other means to a primary care provider. They are not meant to replace a dedicated clinic for most.
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So open NP clinics as the PCP for the have-nots. Leave the private clinics for self and group insured people?
 
#66
#66
Rasputin_Vol said:
Yeah, "if they have the means". Meanwhile, the gov't still takes their money even if they choose not to use the gov't funded school and support private schools, while those that do not have the means are trapped in public school.

The same would be true if you socialized medicine. Those with the means would avoid it if it is possible, where the lower and middle classes are left with sub-par health care choices.

Great analogy...
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It's not an analogy. It's fact.
 
#67
#67
allvol123 said:
So do I. Not unlike any other professions. Some people make C's while others make A's.

I still see your original point is rather absurd and think you are just stirring the pot out of boredom.
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What do they call the guy that graduated last in his medical class? Doctor.

I am stirring the pot a little, but I have immediate family members in both the education and medical fields. They are both necessary to the future of this country.
 
#68
#68
UT IE 95 said:
So learning how to communicate effectively isn't as important as diagnosing that rash on my elbow? Right.
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There are millions of people that are able to communicate effectively and that work at Starbucks or O'Charleys. Not too many people out there that are doctors.

BTW, doctors are able to walk and chew gum at the sametime. I'm sure they have the ability to know human anatomy and how to communicate effectively, also...
 
#69
#69
kptvol said:
Also, you can't see your doctor in the Summer, the month of December, weekends, Labor Day, or after 3pm. If you have poor behavior, your doctor will punish you by taking your temperature rectally.
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Forget the temperature. Why not go with a full prostate exam.
 
#71
#71
Rasputin_Vol said:
There are millions of people that are able to communicate effectively and that work at Starbucks or O'Charleys. Not too many people out there that are doctors.

BTW, doctors are able to walk and chew gum at the sametime. I'm sure they have the ability to know human anatomy and how to communicate effectively, also...
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Just like I've had bad doctors, I've had bad servers at Starbucks and O'Chucks. They are both failures. I don't see the point.
 
#73
#73
UT IE 95 said:
Just like I've had bad doctors, I've had bad servers at Starbucks and O'Chucks. They are both failures. I don't see the point.
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No one argued that bad doctors or bad servers are failures. :unsure:

Are you trying to change the subject?
 
#74
#74
imo, the only two choices that anybody considers are sacrificing the few (poor) for the benefit of the many (rich/middle class) OR sacrificing the many (rich/middle class) for the sake of the few (poor). . . i.e. the current system v. socialized medicine. Is there not some middle ground?

Somebody stated that major medical is pretty inexpensive. . . that is true for MANY Americans. On the flip side, for those with pre-existing conditions, getting health insurance can be very challenging and expensive. It seems that, if Americans were to be more reasonable about their health-insurance expectations, insurance would be much more affordable for everyone? That is, if people were to pay for checkups and routine medical procedures, then the insurance companies would be more able to offer "universal" insurance.
 
#75
#75
Speaking as a teacher, I have no problem with an MD making what they make. No one can sue me for malpractice. While I can have a positive impact on someone's life, I can't drastically affect their health, quality of life or even whether they live or die if I make a mistake.

On the issue of payment - I was one of the uninsured. However, it was my choice. I was self-employed and didn't want to pay the high premiums for health insurance. Instead, I wanted HBO, import beers, more dinners out, bigger car payments, etc. No one owed me health care.
 
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