What's best for the future of UT football: Dooley teams win or... (merged)

#251
#251
VKAman said:
That and the fact that he was coming from the NFL as opposed to Louisiana Tech...

All we had were secondary violations. The NCAA punishment thing is way overblown.
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Where there's smoke (fog machines?) there's fire.

Don't forget that Kiffin was a prominent recruiter at USC during the time period that the NCAA is currently examining...
 
#252
#252
Here is my question... did anybody honestly think that Phil was going to hit 10 wins regularly right away? I can honestly say... or at least believe..... 3 out of 4 of you wouldn't have thought Phil would have been so successfull so fast. Dooley has the intangibles to be great.... either support the coach... or just don't bother to show up when Fall comes around.... I'll be there cheering loud and proud as ALWAYS for our VOLS!
 
#253
#253
Tenacious D said:
The East Berliners were happy to be living under communist rule, and had no desire to go elsewhere, whatsoever. What a great mayor for having convinced them to stay. Behind that large retaining wall.
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:lolabove: Great analogy...
 
#254
#254
bflynn2 said:
Why don't you let CDD coach and recruit a full year. Rainbow club west has some Kiffin knee pads for sale. I hate post like this because you will be happy if we win and say I told you so if we lose. pick a side or GTFO!
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You have every right to disagree, but this post adds nothing to the discussion...
 
#255
#255
oregonvol said:
No. Brown was the furthest thing from being a loser. He had alot of success at UNC before he got a big job in a major conference where he was expected to compete for championships.
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The record he had at UNC would be clearly construed here as mediocre
 
#259
#259
oregonvol said:
No. Brown was the furthest thing from being a loser. He had alot of success at UNC before he got a big job in a major conference where he was expected to compete for championships.
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OK, I'll concede that he wasn't expected to win national championships at UNC.

I guess what I'm trying to say is this, I'm going to assume that Hamilton did his job, and CDD is hungry and will work his butt off at this opportunity. If not, then look on the bright side...we won't be left at the altar, so we can take our time in hiring a new coach and an AD.

I guess to use a recruiting phrase, he has a lot of upside, its up to him to make it now. And that's what I'm going to do, see what he does with it. If he blows, I'll grab a pitchfork and torch and meet you guys at Calhouns or wherever.
 
#261
#261
GahLee said:
A swing and a miss.

I'm talking about beyond this year as well...I'm saying that 8 wins can be looked at in many different lights.

UT wins 8 games, but has losses against UF, UGA, Bama...not so hot.

UT wins 8 games and beats UF and UGA, suddenly the season has a little more optimism to it.
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I'm not missing your point; you're missing mine...

If we win 8 games and beat UF and UGA, then some of our four losses were to South Carolina/Ole Miss/Kentucky type teams. That wouldn't be any better of a situation.
 
#264
#264
I'm sorry to be so blunt, but this is a stupid question.

Of course it is better if Dooley wins. If he fails, it sets the program back by many years, with no guarantee that the next guy will be any better.

And by the way, no coach is guaranteed to win anywhere. A coach who is a good fit at one place may not be at another, or vice versa. Doug Dickey was outstanding at Tennessee, then he went to Florida, where he took over a 9-1-1 team, had the pick of better talent to boot, and still did poorly.

Anyone who roots against Dooley thinking he'll get fired and we'll get a "better" coach needs a lobotomy.
 
#265
#265
jarvol said:
Coach Years Years Games Won Lost Tied Pct
(Student coached teams) 1891-93, 1896-97 5 23 12 11 0 .522
J.A. Pierce 1899-1900 2 14 9 4 1 .654
George Kelley 1901 1 8 3 3 2 .500
H.F. Fisher 1902-03 2 17 10 7 0 .588
S.D. Crawford 1904 1 9 3 5 1 .389
J.D. DePree 1905-06 2 18 4 11 3 .305
George Levene 1907-09 3 28 15 10 3 .589
Andrew A. (Alex) Stone 1910 1 9 3 5 1 .389
Z.G. Clevenger 1911-15 5 43 26 15 2 .628
John R. Bender 1916-20 3 27 18 5 4 .741
M.B. Banks 1921-25 5 45 27 15 3 .633
Robert R. Neyland 1926-34, 36-40, 46-52 21 216 173 31 12 .829
W.H. Britton 1935 1 9 4 5 0 .444
John Barnhill 1941-45 4 39 32 5 2 .846
Harvey Robinson 1953-54 2 21 10 10 1 .500
Bowden Wyatt 1955-62 8 82 49 29 4 .622
Jim McDonald 1963 1 10 5 5 0 .500
Doug Dickey 1964-69 6 65 46 15 4 .738
Bill Battle 1970-76 7 83 59 22 2 .723
Johnny Majors+ 1977-92 16 186 116 62 8 .645
Phillip Fulmer+ 1992-2008 17 204 152 52 0 .745
Lane Kiffin 2009 1 13 7 6 0 .538
Total (21 coaches) 112 1,169 783 333 53 .692

If you want to look since Neyland and 1926 then you have:

Since 1926 - 84 928 653 242 33 .721

The 3 best tenures ever were:
Neyland - .829
Barnhill - .846
Fulmer - .745

If you want to cherry pick those 3 tenures then you have:
Neyland, Barnhill, Fulmer 42 459 357 88 14 .793

So the best ever at UT is .793 which translates to 9.52 wins a year in a 12 year season. Since 1926 UT is .721 which translates to 8.65 wins per year and historically it is .692 which translates to 8.30 wins per year.

Some of you unrealistic peeps might want to end the delusional expectations.
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I see your point. Once a team performs to a certain level over the course of a period of time, their fans should simply succumb to their respective lot in life, whatever it may be. It is unchanging at that point.

For example:

Harvard was a dominant program in 1902. I guess they must still be today.

Florida State was pathetic in the 70's. Too bad they couldn't eventually rise to prominence.
 
#266
#266
jsc1973 said:
I'm sorry to be so blunt, but this is a stupid question.

Of course it is better if Dooley wins. If he fails, it sets the program back by many years, with no guarantee that the next guy will be any better.

And by the way, no coach is guaranteed to win anywhere. A coach who is a good fit at one place may not be at another, or vice versa. Doug Dickey was outstanding at Tennessee, then he went to Florida, where he took over a 9-1-1 team, had the pick of better talent to boot, and still did poorly.

Anyone who roots against Dooley thinking he'll get fired and we'll get a "better" coach needs a lobotomy.
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The thread is starting to repeat itself. I believe this was covered around the first page.

Everyone here (Vols fans) wants Dooley to win every game he plays as the UT HFC.
 
#267
#267
jsc1973 said:
I'm sorry to be so blunt, but this is a stupid question.

Of course it is better if Dooley wins. If he fails, it sets the program back by many years, with no guarantee that the next guy will be any better.

And by the way, no coach is guaranteed to win anywhere. A coach who is a good fit at one place may not be at another, or vice versa. Doug Dickey was outstanding at Tennessee, then he went to Florida, where he took over a 9-1-1 team, had the pick of better talent to boot, and still did poorly.

Anyone who roots against Dooley thinking he'll get fired and we'll get a "better" coach needs a lobotomy.
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That's not the question. The question is about quick failure vs slow painful mediocrity highlighted by chicken bowl appearances.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
#270
#270
BigPapaVol said:
That's not the question. The question is about quick failure vs slow painful mediocrity highlighted by chicken bowl appearances.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
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I miss the Peach Bowl.....so much better than the Chicken Bowl...

And now we're back from our ADD moment...
 
#274
#274
VKAman said:
I'm not missing your point; you're missing mine...

If we win 8 games and beat UF and UGA, then some of our four losses were to South Carolina/Ole Miss/Kentucky type teams. That wouldn't be any better of a situation.
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When Barry Switzer had a couple of down years at Oklahoma in the early '80s, the school's AD told him that if he went 10-2 the next year and beat Texas and Nebraska, he wouldn't be fired.

Switzer told the dim-wit that there was no disgrace in losing to Texas and Nebraska, but that if he went 10-2 and lost to Kansas State and Iowa State, then they should fire him.

If we win eight games some year, the losses had better be to good teams. It's the Ron Zooks of the world who occasionally beat great teams on sheer talent getting a hot hand, but lose to weak teams because they can't coach.
 
#275
#275
grace2u said:
OK, I'll concede that he wasn't expected to win national championships at UNC.

I guess what I'm trying to say is this, I'm going to assume that Hamilton did his job, and CDD is hungry and will work his butt off at this opportunity. If not, then look on the bright side...we won't be left at the altar, so we can take our time in hiring a new coach and an AD.

I guess to use a recruiting phrase, he has a lot of upside, its up to him to make it now. And that's what I'm going to do, see what he does with it. If he blows, I'll grab a pitchfork and torch and meet you guys at Calhouns or wherever.
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And it's your right to assume that Hamilton did his job, and it's true that no one knows how it will play out. Believe me, I hope I'm 100% wrong about Dooley. But I feel it's important to go ahead and get the torches ready and light them as soon as we can, because we've already seen how long it takes to get rid of a coach here when we're mired in mediocrity (see Fulmer's last 5 or so years), and I don't really want to go through another 5 or so years of it before we get someone who can actually win.
 
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