What's best for the future of UT football: Dooley teams win or... (merged)

#376
#376
GahLee said:
He is great at contorting what someone else has said, I'll give him that.
Click to expand...

By, "contorting" do you mean, "using my previous comments, verbatim, as a means of highlighting the many illogical weaknesses which are responsible for the overwhelming errancy of the argument I attempted to propose in spite of many facts, including my feigned ignorance of even the most basic premises of arithmetic, at which point I was simply reduced to sophomoric name-calling when all tenants of my ramshackle defense had been obliterated, and left me utterly exposed in an indefensible position"?

If you consider that to the handiwork of a contortionist, then consider me Stretch Armstrong, brosuf.
 
#378
#378
UTVOL02 said:
Gene Chizik couldn't win in the Big 12 but he did ok in the SEC last season and has a pretty solid class coming in this year too. Next...
Click to expand...

Yeah the Big 12 and the WAC are comparable. :crazy:

You're just reaching now.
 
#379
#379
grace2u said:
Ok, so here is the logical question we can gather from this thread....Who?

Tell me "the guy" you'd have hired and how much you would've paid.
Click to expand...

Gruden - however much I could afford...

if I couldn't afford it, then...

Lovie Smith - however much I could afford...

if I couldn't afford it, then...

Gary Patterson - however much I could afford...

if I couldn't afford it, then...

Kyle Whittingham - however much I could afford...

...and on and on...

When you consider that we probably could afford to pay a coach up to 8-10 million a year, I think I'd get somebody in here before I got 100 or so names down my list and to Derek Dooley. At that point, I'd just name Kippy Brown interim coach and keep looking.

But your question contains an element of misunderstanding. It's not just about calling up a coach and offering them x sum of money. If you're athletic director, you need to be able to sell your program and recruit the right guy. I don't think Hamilton did either and, consequently, I don't think he did his job.
 
#380
#380
I feel like Dooley's potential far exceeds anything Chizik will ever do. I can't ever see him winning the SEC west.
 
#381
#381
timmy said:
Yeah the Big 12 and the WAC are comparable. :crazy:

You're just reaching now.
Click to expand...

Oh, so 5-19 in the Big 12 is leaps and bounds better than 17-20 in the WAC? And I'm the one who's reaching? LOL

And don't forget, quite a few of those losses were to SEC OOC games.
 
Last edited:
#383
#383
utmba93 said:
We certainly won't hit a homerun if we keep swinging at balls in the dirt. However, I do believe Pujols once hit one after it bounced. Dooley could fit that analogy well. So, there is hope. Yippee!
Click to expand...

I thought you stayed at Duke because you liked it there?

Now you just seem bitter.
 
#384
#384
If Dooley goes more than 2 or 3 years being mediocre he will be fired or run out of town like he should. If Kiffin would have stayed and was mediocre he would have been fired. If we bring in someone else and they are mediocre, they too, will be fired. Just like Fulmer. Let the guys whose job it is to pick and grade the coach pick and grade the coach.

You cannot determine what Dooley's success will be here based upon is success at Louisiana Tech. The situation there was completely different. He did not have the staff or players to be successful in any conference, maybe not even in the fcs series. All we can do is stand behind our program and support them no matter what.
 
#385
#385
jarvol said:
Coach Years Years Games Won Lost Tied Pct
(Student coached teams) 1891-93, 1896-97 5 23 12 11 0 .522
J.A. Pierce 1899-1900 2 14 9 4 1 .654
George Kelley 1901 1 8 3 3 2 .500
H.F. Fisher 1902-03 2 17 10 7 0 .588
S.D. Crawford 1904 1 9 3 5 1 .389
J.D. DePree 1905-06 2 18 4 11 3 .305
George Levene 1907-09 3 28 15 10 3 .589
Andrew A. (Alex) Stone 1910 1 9 3 5 1 .389
Z.G. Clevenger 1911-15 5 43 26 15 2 .628
John R. Bender 1916-20 3 27 18 5 4 .741
M.B. Banks 1921-25 5 45 27 15 3 .633
Robert R. Neyland 1926-34, 36-40, 46-52 21 216 173 31 12 .829
W.H. Britton 1935 1 9 4 5 0 .444
John Barnhill 1941-45 4 39 32 5 2 .846
Harvey Robinson 1953-54 2 21 10 10 1 .500
Bowden Wyatt 1955-62 8 82 49 29 4 .622
Jim McDonald 1963 1 10 5 5 0 .500
Doug Dickey 1964-69 6 65 46 15 4 .738
Bill Battle 1970-76 7 83 59 22 2 .723
Johnny Majors+ 1977-92 16 186 116 62 8 .645
Phillip Fulmer+ 1992-2008 17 204 152 52 0 .745
Lane Kiffin 2009 1 13 7 6 0 .538
Total (21 coaches) 112 1,169 783 333 53 .692

If you want to look since Neyland and 1926 then you have:

Since 1926 - 84 928 653 242 33 .721

The 3 best tenures ever were:
Neyland - .829
Barnhill - .846
Fulmer - .745

If you want to cherry pick those 3 tenures then you have:
Neyland, Barnhill, Fulmer 42 459 357 88 14 .793

So the best ever at UT is .793 which translates to 9.52 wins a year in a 12 year season. Since 1926 UT is .721 which translates to 8.65 wins per year and historically it is .692 which translates to 8.30 wins per year.

Some of you unrealistic peeps might want to end the delusional expectations.
Click to expand...

look at Florida, and see what hiring the right coach can do

just because our historic average is 8 wins a year, doesn't mean we shouldn't expect more given the hires Florida and Bama made
 
#386
#386
GahLee said:
Ok, then, give him credit for 13 if you want.

It's an opinion and no, it isn't preposterous.

Pair, Palardy, Fulton, Dixon were committed before Dooley was hired and still signed.

I would be very interested to see what those players had to say about their decisions to stay at UT despite Kiffin leaving and what role Dooley had...either way, it's just an opinion.
Click to expand...
Which guys did he go out to woo and bring home? Seems to me that it's about 5. The remainder simply reaffirmed previous commitment or were unrecruited by everyone, including us.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
#387
#387
Our historic average is 8 wins per year because before this decade, we were playing 11 and 10 game schedules.
 
#389
#389
oregonvol said:
Gruden - however much I could afford...

if I couldn't afford it, then...

Lovie Smith - however much I could afford...

if I couldn't afford it, then...

Gary Patterson - however much I could afford...

if I couldn't afford it, then...

Kyle Whittingham - however much I could afford...

...and on and on...

When you consider that we probably could afford to pay a coach up to 8-10 million a year, I think I'd get somebody in here before I got 100 or so names down my list and to Derek Dooley. At that point, I'd just name Kippy Brown interim coach and keep looking.

But your question contains an element of misunderstanding. It's not just about calling up a coach and offering them x sum of money. If you're athletic director, you need to be able to sell your program and recruit the right guy. I don't think Hamilton did either and, consequently, I don't think he did his job.
Click to expand...


This is ridiculous. None of those coaches were worth 8-10 million. Getting the right coach is about getting the right fit. Wittingham is a great coach, but Hammy didn't think he'd be a good fit here. And Dooley was high on Hamilton's list, and I promise you don't do the research he did for...
 
#390
#390
UTVOL02 said:
Gene Chizik couldn't win in the Big 12 but he did ok in the SEC last season and has a pretty solid class coming in this year too. Next...
Click to expand...

Auburn didn't win a championship and the jury is still out on Chizik. Yet, the Big 12 is far better than the WAC and Chizik only had two years there.

I would have been against Chizik hire as many of the Auburn fans were last year. But don't think that anomoly proves anythiing other than there are some people who have the second or third best lottery ticket.

Speaking of Auburn, I wonder if Guz Malzahn was considered. I'd say that's where a lot of that loving your giving Chizik belongs.
 
#391
#391
And to those who think they could hire a better HC, I suggest you go apply for the AD job and see if the board thinks you are better than Hamilton too.
 
#392
#392
oregonvol said:
Gruden - however much I could afford...

if I couldn't afford it, then...

Lovie Smith - however much I could afford...

if I couldn't afford it, then...

Gary Patterson - however much I could afford...

if I couldn't afford it, then...

Kyle Whittingham - however much I could afford...

...and on and on...

When you consider that we probably could afford to pay a coach up to 8-10 million a year, I think I'd get somebody in here before I got 100 or so names down my list and to Derek Dooley. At that point, I'd just name Kippy Brown interim coach and keep looking.

But your question contains an element of misunderstanding. It's not just about calling up a coach and offering them x sum of money. If you're athletic director, you need to be able to sell your program and recruit the right guy. I don't think Hamilton did either and, consequently, I don't think he did his job.
Click to expand...

Welcome to the theater of the absurd.

The running joke was that if you lose in year two of a college program that the fanbase would be calling for your head.

You are calling this hire a failure less than 4 weeks since being named the coach, and before he organizes a practice.

Being critical of a coach or AD is one thing, I think its ok to criticize while supporting, but to judge the hire before he holds a practice is defenseless. You have no idea how this will turn out.
 
#393
#393
UTVOL02 said:
Oh, so 5-19 in the Big 12 is leaps and bounds better than 17-20 in the WAC? And I'm the one who's reaching? LOL

And don't forget, quite a few of those losses were to SEC OOC games.
Click to expand...

You are clearly reaching.

Saying UT should hire either is absurd. We didn't even interview Chizik. Dooley earned the same treatment.
 
#395
#395
What an idiotic question. Success breeds success. The more wins, the better recruits, the better recognition, etc.

Before you start a thread questioning him, give him and his staff an opportunity. If you asked this question next year after a losing record, then that would be "MORE" appropriate. Notice I didn't say appropriate, but it would be more than asking such a dumb question now.
:mad:
 
#396
#396
UTVOL02 said:
lol

I give up arguing with you gloom and doomers. Have fun hating on our program, sounds awesome! later...
Click to expand...

No need to limit it to us 'gloom and doomers,' you should give up on arguing altogether. Surely you can do something else better.
 
#397
#397
PennVol said:
This is ridiculous. None of those coaches were worth 8-10 million. Getting the right coach is about getting the right fit. Wittingham is a great coach, but Hammy didn't think he'd be a good fit here. And Dooley was high on Hamilton's list, and I promise you don't do the research he did for...
Click to expand...

Of course, everyone said Saban wasn't worth 5 million 3 years ago. Now no one is saying it.

My point is, I don't really care what we pay for a head coach, as long as we get the right guy (and don't go bankrupt). We can afford to pay top dollar here, and, in a time of great need, like the situation Kiffin put us in, we should have been willing to open the bank vaults to get the best guy possible.
 
#398
#398
why people are so convinced Gruden and Lovie Smith would have been home run hires doesn't make sense to me. The only thing you would get from that is espn being all over the hire. You can't call Dooley a strike out, and Hamilton a flop b/c he didn't go get either of those coaches.
 
#399
#399
"I WANT ATTENTION, I WANT ATTENTION!!!" OP wants attention, that's all this thread is about. He wanted a top 5 thread and now he's got it...

Anything that has me choosing losing over winning is a bad choice. Dooley is going to be a great coach and pull in great talent, look at our top 10 class this year.... Da'Rick Rogers, Hunter, Nance, Neal, we are going to be just fine.

NegaVols, go buy some red and gold and move to the west coast, no one wants you here!
 
#400
#400
jps2194 said:
What an idiotic question. Success breeds success. The more wins, the better recruits, the better recognition, etc.

Before you start a thread questioning him, give him and his staff an opportunity. If you asked this question next year after a losing record, then that would be "MORE" appropriate. Notice I didn't say appropriate, but it would be more than asking such a dumb question now.
:mad:
Click to expand...

If success breeds success, what does Dooley's tenure at LaTech breed?
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
New posts
You must log in or register to reply here.

VN Store



Back
Top