What's best for the future of UT football: Dooley teams win or... (merged)

#901
#901
tvolsfan said:
Let me say this. It doesn't bother me that some people are optimistic. It definitely doesn't me that almost everyone (me included) wants the worst for Kiffin. What does bother me is that our way of coping with a disastrous situation is to remember the past in a completely different way. 99 percent of people here, if asked this whether they wanted Dooley or Kiffin 2 months ago, would have said Kiffin, with the exception being people like posivol. Many of the same people now talk like Kiffin was killing the program and Dooley will be an excellent hire. Seems like the way many people are coping with this is to imagine the situation was different than it actually was. That seems like something out of Shutter Island.
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I do not think Kiffin was killing the program, but we would've been the ones responding to our friends of rival teams about having a 7th grade QB committed. I killed mt UK friends with Gillespie doing the same thing. I think it is fair to say we do not know what Kiffin would've been able to do over the next 5 years had he stayed (I actually thought Zook was turning around Illinois a few years ago) and we do not know what Dooley will do the next 5 years either. I do know this: I want people in Neyland Stadium that want CDD there and think that he is turning it around, not people wondering if he fails miserably fast maybe we can get a "real coach". Winning is a lot about attitude and atmosphere and we are not starting out holding up our end of the bargain. TIFWIW...
 
#902
#902
After 3 seasons...

Mack Brown was 11-22

Jimmy Johnson was 17-16-1... 21-21-3 after 4 seasons.

I could go on but the point is, records after 3 years as first time head coach at whatever losing program doesn't prove anything. You have to look a bit deeper.

By the way... Larry Coker was 35-3 at Miami. anyone want him?
 
#903
#903
TheRain said:
After 3 seasons...

Mack Brown was 11-22

Jimmy Johnson was 17-16-1... 21-21-3 after 4 seasons.

I could go on but the point is, records after 3 years as first time head coach at whatever losing program doesn't prove anything. You have to look a bit deeper.

By the way... Larry Coker was 35-3 at Miami. anyone want him?
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Good post!
 
#904
#904
Well before we all jump onto the crash and burn ship, lets think about this for a second. Okay, so we know that Dooley was a risky hire. We also know that at first, Lane Kiffin was a risky hire (who had also had about the same amount of experience as Dooley, and in all reality had very similar results). The first question you need to ask yourself is, what in the sam hell was the difference rather than the obviously polar opposite personalities? Okay, the only thing we learned about Kiffin in his first year here was that he could recruit (if he had a good staff, that is). We simply didn't see enough of him to make any sort of final judgement on his coaching abilities. He won some, he lost some. Okay, no biggie there. So we've really established absolutely nothing on Lane Kiffin, and in no way can we compare that to Dooley yet, considering we have established even less about him. Which breeds the obvious question, what is even the point of this thread? Because there really isn't much i can get out of the 57 pages of chatter of which it contains, other than the same circular argument we've been having, which is, some of you like the Dooley hire, and some of you don't.

However, none of you can predict the future, and therefore i believe it to be best to save these matters until after the man has coached a few games.
 
#905
#905
volstexans said:
You and the OP share the same closed minded assumption that mediocrity is the best UT can expect from CDD.

If this premise were true, Hamilton should already be gone. This premise is flawed, incorrect, and closed minded. Let this thread die.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
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When did I say the absolute best he could do is Mediocrity?
 
#906
#906
TheRain said:
After 3 seasons...

Mack Brown was 11-22

Jimmy Johnson was 17-16-1... 21-21-3 after 4 seasons.

I could go on but the point is, records after 3 years as first time head coach at whatever losing program doesn't prove anything. You have to look a bit deeper.

By the way... Larry Coker was 35-3 at Miami. anyone want him?
Click to expand...

The number of coaches with losing records after 3 seasons, who continued to having losing records is much longer. I can assure you.
 
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#907
#907
g8terh8ter_eric said:
The 12 years before him were pretty interesting. Not exactly results that people think should be dummy proof considering the talent level in Texas. Look at Ron Zook in Florida as an example as well.
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Florida is more split up with 3 major programs in there. And Texas wasn't doing that bad in the before him. Other, better programs have worse stretches.
 
#908
#908
g8terh8ter_eric said:
I still can't believe we are discussing his conference record at La. Tech, that means jack now. Dooley is past La. Tech now, let's at least give him some respect that he's now OUR coach. If he can win here, that's all that matters. Trying to measure a small conference with limited resources to that of the SEC and saying they can be compared is foolishness, IMO.
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Everyone here talks about "limited resources." Funny how no one talks about the limited competition (Utah State) as well.
 
#909
#909
UTMark said:
I do not think Kiffin was killing the program, but we would've been the ones responding to our friends of rival teams about having a 7th grade QB committed. I killed mt UK friends with Gillespie doing the same thing. I think it is fair to say we do not know what Kiffin would've been able to do over the next 5 years had he stayed (I actually thought Zook was turning around Illinois a few years ago) and we do not know what Dooley will do the next 5 years either. I do know this: I want people in Neyland Stadium that want CDD there and think that he is turning it around, not people wondering if he fails miserably fast maybe we can get a "real coach". Winning is a lot about attitude and atmosphere and we are not starting out holding up our end of the bargain. TIFWIW...
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Why the hell should we care what other fans think?
 
#910
#910
TheRain said:
After 3 seasons...

Mack Brown was 11-22

Jimmy Johnson was 17-16-1... 21-21-3 after 4 seasons.

I could go on but the point is, records after 3 years as first time head coach at whatever losing program doesn't prove anything. You have to look a bit deeper.

By the way... Larry Coker was 35-3 at Miami. anyone want him?
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I looked deep enough. The only thing that makes him seem to be anything special is his ties to Saban. Other than that, this is a huge risk. He could turn out well, but his job at LA Tech is not an indicator of that.
 
#912
#912
oklavol said:
The number of coaches with losing records after 3 seasons, who continued to having losing records and were terminated is much longer. I can assure you.
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And in most cases that go the other way, Id guess the teams were far worse when they were taken over.
 
#913
#913
tvolsfan said:
Let me say this. It doesn't bother me that some people are optimistic. It definitely doesn't me that almost everyone (me included) wants the worst for Kiffin. What does bother me is that our way of coping with a disastrous situation is to remember the past in a completely different way. 99 percent of people here, if asked this whether they wanted Dooley or Kiffin 2 months ago, would have said Kiffin, with the exception being people like posivol. Many of the same people now talk like Kiffin was killing the program and Dooley will be an excellent hire. Seems like the way many people are coping with this is to imagine the situation was different than it actually was. That seems like something out of Shutter Island.
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So true, and this happens with pretty much every coach/player/recruit we lose...

"Kiffin would have been on probation within a few years." Right.
 
#914
#914
I don't think Kiffin was doing a bad job. As far as results he had a A minus or B plus from me. I still hated defending him. It was a relief when he was gone that I did not have to have a target on my chest for being a UT fan. I do believe we lost a year maybe two in progress because of the transition. The recruits we lost or did not get on D will be felt heavily in 2011. 2010 will be like a mirage. We will play decent and people will remain optmistic. 2011 will rely heavily on player development and a few key recruits in the 2011 class we must get or it will not be pretty on D. Our O looks pretty solid IMO though. Oline could of used one or two more guys but we got enough good ones if they stay healthy. I do not think people are that delusional. I think they are just being positive and truthfully we do not know what is to come. We are all guessing.
 
#916
#916
I think Dooley should allow the Vols to have one loss per decade just to show sportsmanship. Like they say, fairness is next to ... something....maybe fairport...or ...
 
#917
#917
Just read this thread for the first time. Great work! That other thread was unbelievably stupid. What fan would WANT their team to lose so they MIGHT get a "name" coach in 3 years? Dumbest crap ever, this one parodies it perfectly!
 
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#919
#919
We have to be very aggressive with JC prospects for the DT and O line in 2011 as we'll need one or two to play right away. We also need to work the early entries very hard to get a few more guys ready to potentially contribute in 2011. If we can do those things we have a chance to stay reasonably competitive, if we don't the wheels could fall off in 2011.
 
#920
#920
bUTrosbUTrosVOLie said:
I think Dooley should allow the Vols to have one loss per decade just to show sportsmanship. Like they say, fairness is next to ... something....maybe fairport...or ...
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Fair is Fail's slower cousin. Kick 'em in the knees, blitz on every down, always go for 2, and cheat, cheat, cheat. Pay the refs, unleash the hostesses, bring in Switzer as a consultant....
 
#921
#921
Come on people...... It takes several years to build a team so don't judge DD by his first year or two in wins and losses. Judge the team by its intensity, desire to win and never quitting. If they continue to do those things...... the Vols will once again contend for the SEC Championship. Dooley has it in his bloodlines to do just that. You will see. Book it!!!
 
#923
#923
This is like asking what is worth, silver or gold. One is worth a lot, and one is worth beyond anything you can get a hold of in an hour.
 
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