Will Butch Jones be a better coach this year?

#126
#126
Butch reminds me of a young Saban.Success at lower tier schools.A great recruiter.A burning desire too win.A relentless work ethic.Only real difference is age and different stages in their careers. I think if you as Nick himself if he was a better coach when he was Butch s age or now.It would be a no brainer.
 
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#127
#127
The 4th quarter of the Georgia game convinced me of all I need to know in the game day coaching department.

QB woes can wreck that aspect of a team. Happens at all levels and we were not an exception late in last season.
 
#128
#128
sjt18 said:
So you are saying that Dooley should have gotten one or two more years? He never coached a roster made up totally of his players.

You can ALWAYS evaluate a coach based on what they do with what they've got. I think we'd agree that this is a 6-8 win roster, right? Next year is an 9+ win roster IMO once you also consider that the schedule appears to lighten a tad. He will have 3 full classes of his own creation by then which will probably comprise well over 85% of the roster. He will have had 3+ years to shape and develop those players.

I think you are saying we need to see steady improvement and if so I completely agree with that.
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No, Dooley was unqualified to begin with, and did not deserve the job. He did nothing to inspire our base of fans, he lost badly to most ranked teams that he play, lost his only Bowl game, and lost to one of the worst Kentucky teams of all time. Butch has said and done all the right things so far, and has recruited top talent, the biggest mistake Butch has made so far is starting Peterman at Florida. Losing to Vandy in Neyland is unacceptable too, that can't be allowed to happen.

Yes, we expect steady improvement, but more than that the Vols need to play with the swagger and confidence like the days of old. The rest of the SEC needs to fear coming into to Neyland Stadium, and until that happens were are still rebuilding, IMO.

I like Butch, and his offensive coaches, but after what I saw last season, I'm not really sure the Defensive staff can get the Vols to where we want them. I hope that I am wrong.
 
#130
#130
sjt18 said:
:lolabove:

Seriously though I would settle for good, consistent effort, great coaching, 6-8 wins, all games competitive, and another solid recruiting class.
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Of course I was joking about last year's expectations.

No one in their right mind had high expectations for last year's team based on:

1) returning talent & experience
2) culture of losing that had to be overcome
3) new scheme on both sides of the ball


My X factor for last year's expectations was the projected (preseason) SOS that didn't account for 2 teams that finished with 12 wins (Auburn & Mizzou).

Ultimately, getting blown out by 3 teams that won 12 games is not unexpected (sadly).
 
#131
#131
Ten_Titans said:
The 4th quarter of the Georgia game convinced me of all I need to know in the game day coaching department.

QB woes can wreck that aspect of a team. Happens at all levels and we were not an exception late in last season.
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Come on..really? Nothing will EVER EVER EVER EVER be as worse as Dooley at Florida in 2012..massive lead..never calls a time out in the 2nd half..Let's Florida steamroll to a win. THAT was the worst coaching I have ever seen.
 
#133
#133
sjt18 said:
Mizzou lost most of the pieces that made the machine run last year. Best two DL's, 2 LB's, 3 of 4 starting DB's including by far and away the best one.

On O, they lost ALL of the WR's that any SEC team has reason to fear. They return two solid RB's but lost their leader. Their OL lost two including their LT and best player.

Mauk started 4 games and threw for under 50% in 3 of them... including UT. That's hardly "best QB in the SEC" type stuff. Now he'll be trying to improve that without DGB, Washington, and Lucas... and without Britt.
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This happens quite a bit for Mizzou. Pinkel lives off redshirts and does it quite well. Pinkel is a genius when it comes to dline. Aldon Smith, Justin Smith, Sheldon Richardson, Ziggy Hood, and Kony Ealy are off the top of my head. Their lines will be very good like it is every year.

Stats are always misleading. I watched Maty Mauk play vs USCjr and UF. I've never seen a quarterback make UF's secondary look so bad, that was before their injury bug in the secondary also. He is also a threat with his legs.



All this before you even consider that the schedule last year literally laid down in front of them. UGA, UF, and UT ALL lost critical players before playing Mizzou.
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Thats not true. UGA's only big injuries were the running backs at that time. They still forced 3 turnovers from Murray. UF just lost a tight game to LSU the week before. The very next week Maty Mauk torched them. UT wasn't going to stand any chance against UT with Worley, they dominated us on both sides of the ball.

That... is ludicrous. It isn't even close. UT would have an advantage even without the new players.
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Based on what? Recruiting rankings that don't include that Tennessee only has 13 juniors and seniors that will contribute this year. Not start, only contribute. You can't win that way. Out of Dooley's 3 classes, only 10 4 stars remain. The gap is not that big considering that alone and not taking in the fact this is the first time since 2008 our dline has had the same dline coach for 2 years in a row. Vandy has had the luxury of redshirting over 20 of their freshmen last year, UT not so much. The talent level is very similar unfortunately.


Mizzou had a charmed season and SOME of us knew that Auburn had a lot of talent.
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Mizzou has a good chance to win 8 games this year, and I'm sure people on here were predicting AU to the NC game. It was a penciled in win for most people.
 
#136
#136
It's a new year and I'm hopeful we see massive improvement. Last year's Georgia game has me hopeful. A lot of things have been beaten up here. Why did butch and co take 32 last year? Lack of depth anyone? A lot of the depth and speed issues go back to Dooley's 2012 class (which some have given a F) and Kiffin's sudden departure that class and those questionable recruits that left the program. I don't know how many times I heard last year "Tennessee is getting turned around, but depth is an issue is key positions".
 
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#137
#137
StlCardinals2618 said:
Not according to NFL.com and ESPN. The only legitimate argument is Nick Marshall, who only fits in Malzahn's offense and Jacob Coker, who has never played a down in the SEC.
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Those same people also said Ryan Leaf was better than Peyton..so...yeah..
 
#138
#138
FLVOL_79 said:
Come on..really? Nothing will EVER EVER EVER EVER be as worse as Dooley at Florida in 2012..massive lead..never calls a time out in the 2nd half..Let's Florida steamroll to a win. THAT was the worst coaching I have ever seen.
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By "convinced", I meant I was convinced he could coach.

Coaching alone is what willed that game to OT.
 
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#140
#140
sameolvol said:
Thanks and a "like" for you and your coach friend for pointing out the proper extrapolation for this predictable formula. Speed kills. We had none, and even perfect alignment and the most efficient angles won't work when the speed differential between the two opponents is too great to be overcome. Some of us get it.
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A family member and college hall of famerr coach told me once that football boils down to two points of emphasis......SPACING AND MISMATCHES.,,,,common denominator???? Just like Goober says..,,SPEED, SPEED, SPEED....begins and ends with speed!!!!
 
#142
#142
Jones has done such an incredible job recruiting and representing the team it's hard to criticize him but... I didn't think his game management was very good at times last year. Mainly, I thought he did a good job against uga, but did poorly against usc, Mizzou, and Vandy (I know we still won usc).
 
#143
#143
chattavol420 said:
Jones has done such an incredible job recruiting and representing the team it's hard to criticize him but... I didn't think his game management was very good at times last year. Mainly, I thought he did a good job against uga, but did poorly against usc, Mizzou, and Vandy (I know we still won usc).
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He out coached Spurrier. No question about it.
 
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#144
#144
Crazy Ivan said:
I responded to a guy taking a shot at Saban because he lost to Louisiana Monroe or somebody his first year.

And I was responding to a guy who said Saban wouldn't have lost to Vandy last season. If you mean Saban wouldn't have lost to Vandy last season with his Bama team, I agree. If you're point was that Saban wouldn't have lost to Vandy with Butch's team, then I call BS on that and pointed to Saban's loss to UL-M his first season at Bama. And that was after Saban already had an NC under his belt at LSU. I personally don't think Butch would have lost to Vandy last season if Worley and North had been available. I also believe it would have been tough for Saban to overcome those obstacles as well.

I just get irritated with guys talking crap about a guy/team when they have no leg to stand on.

What leg do I not have to stand on? Did Saban not lose to UL-M his first season at Bama? I've not knocked Saban at all. I think he's probably the best coach in CFB, but that doesn't change the fact he lost to UL-M in his first season. Point being, you are at the mercy of what you have to work with when you take over a program.
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C.I. -

I'm not sure if you're responding to my post or not b/c I can't find my original post (not politically correct?).

The OP asked will Butch be better in his 2nd year. I don't know nor does anyone else. I believe "good" coaches have better 2nd years than 1st years on average. I mentioned CBJ in comparison to Saban (could have done the same with Miles, Summlin, Meyer, etc.) only I wanted to point out a specific game in 2007 where UT was favored against Alabama but lost anyway. I wanted to draw a comparison of the coaching style/strategy in which....
1) The comparison coach (Saban) was heavily disfavored
2) Saban's team didn't compare well against UT on talent (at least at that point in his team's maturity)
3) Saban knew he had to "do something" unusual to get momentum on his side and keep the UT off-balance - hence the opening on-side kick

That level of cerebral football strategy was missing in many key areas last year. Does Saban beat UGA or Vandy with our players? I believe he does.

To quote an old saying regarding General Neyland, "He can beat you with his players - or - he can beat you with your players against his own". Greatness.
 
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#146
#146
tm3 said:
Saban, spurrier, franklin, miles, and a few others would have figured out wins against Vandy and UF.
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Yeah... Just like Saban lost to Louisiana-Nobody-State his first year. Spurrier has lost to Kentucky and Vandy at SC, Les Miles almost lost to Dooley, and Franklin DID lose to Dooley. Take your ball and go home.
 
#148
#148
ajvol01 said:
He out coached Spurrier. No question about it.
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Disagree. Not that Spurrier did anything great himself but... Everything went our way that day and we led almost the entire game. We went ultra conservative and tried to sit on our lead and almost ended up losing at the end. We needed a hailmary to retake the lead
 
#149
#149
cbbowlingmd said:
I hate salad.
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Holy crap it took like 50 posts for someone to comment on that. Valid... Valad... Salad... anyway...

A better coach? No, not really. Even though the stage is bigger, I honestly don't think being the HC at UT is all that different than being the HC at Cincy. Same responsibilities, grander stage.
 
#150
#150
iKrager said:
This thread is so silly. Knowing everything we know about last year i.e new QBs, new WRs, new offensive/defensivd schemes, one of the toughests schedules and having to overcome the Dooley effect, I would say he deserves the "benefit of the learning curve", especially after beating USCe and almost beating UGA. This year we have a much more talented offense/defense.
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If you are going to give credit to Butch for "almost" beating injury decimated Georgia, then credit should also be given to Dooley for "almost" beating two or three good teams. I am not a Dooley fan by the way.
 
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