Pac 10 better than the SEC???

#101
#101
lawgator1 said:
Explain, please. I'd seriously like to know where I made my mistake. What's the hsitory on that?

P.S. Thanks for not just taking a meaningless, arrogant, pompous, and downright mean-spirited swipe in my direction. Appreciate that.
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UC Rally Committee | The Rivalry

Andy Smith took over as head coach of the football team and California football was forever changed. Andy Smith led the Wonder Teams of the early 20s, and the Bears, with a lifetime record of 74-16-7, 5-1-1 against Stanford. These teams included the 1920 Wonder Team that went 8-0-0 and scored an unbelievable 510 points to opponent's 14.

Andy Smith: Information from Answers.com

edit: Although during this period there were no college football polls, during the Roaring Twenties, Smith's Wonder Teams were considered to rival Knute Rockne and Notre Dame in terms of success, though these two top teams never met on the field.

Rejuvenation & Pappy's Boys
The 1937 "Thunder Team" rocketed a sputtering California football program back into the national spotlight. Producing the first undefeated season since the Wonder Teams, the 1937 Bears accumulated 214 points to opponent's 33 on their way to a 10-0-1 record and a Rose Bowl victory over Alabama. cAfter a brief respite from football during WWII, the Bears made the 1946 season their worst. Going 2-7-0 in 1946, 1947 looked bleak even with the addition of new Head Coach Lynn O. "Pappy" Waldorf. Pappy envisioned a powerhouse in the Golden Bears and turned bleak predictions into the greatest Cinderella season ever. California ended the season 9-1-0 and greatness once again shone on the horizon. 10 seasons of greatness graced California football during the Pappy Waldorf years. In his career, Pappy garnered a 67-32-4 overall mark, 7-1-2 against Stanford and three Rose Bowl appearances for the Golden Bears.
 
#102
#102
hatvol96 said:
1. OJ Simpson wasn't at USC in the '70s. 2. USC has been playing quality football, with a couple of slight downturns, for the better part of 60 years. 3. Their All Time Team reads like a roll call of the College Football Hall Of Fame. 4. Mike Garrett, Charles White, Sam Cunningham, Ron Yary, Pat Haden, Anthony Munoz, Junior Seau, etc, etc. 5. John McKay. I could go on for another hour, but I'm certain 99.9% of this board is well aware of SC's historical greatness. I'm not in the mood to do educational charity for the .1% that articulates out their anus.
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1. It was the late 60's. I propose I be banned from the board for a week for saying it was the 70's.

2. Sixty years? How does that compare to the likes of Alabama? Tennessee? Georgia? Harvard? Notre Dame? Lehigh? Lafayette?

3. Mike Garrett won the Heisman in 1965. Charles White won it in 1979. Cunningham played in the 1970s. Ron Yary, 1960s. Pat Haden, mid-1970s. Anthony Munoz won the Hesiman in 1979. Junior played in the late 1980's.

The folks you are naming were either huge college players or big NFL stars of their time, but all are in more like the last 40 years. Not saying that USC does not have a ton of success since the mid-60s on, but I'm not at all clear on what they were doing in 1920.

Enjoyed your comment about me speaking out of my anus. That was really funny.
 
#103
#103
droski said:
UC Rally Committee | The Rivalry

Andy Smith took over as head coach of the football team and California football was forever changed. Andy Smith led the Wonder Teams of the early 20s, and the Bears, with a lifetime record of 74-16-7, 5-1-1 against Stanford. These teams included the 1920 Wonder Team that went 8-0-0 and scored an unbelievable 510 points to opponent's 14.

Andy Smith: Information from Answers.com

edit: Although during this period there were no college football polls, during the Roaring Twenties, Smith's Wonder Teams were considered to rival Knute Rockne and Notre Dame in terms of success, though these two top teams never met on the field.

Rejuvenation & Pappy's Boys
The 1937 "Thunder Team" rocketed a sputtering California football program back into the national spotlight. Producing the first undefeated season since the Wonder Teams, the 1937 Bears accumulated 214 points to opponent's 33 on their way to a 10-0-1 record and a Rose Bowl victory over Alabama. cAfter a brief respite from football during WWII, the Bears made the 1946 season their worst. Going 2-7-0 in 1946, 1947 looked bleak even with the addition of new Head Coach Lynn O. "Pappy" Waldorf. Pappy envisioned a powerhouse in the Golden Bears and turned bleak predictions into the greatest Cinderella season ever. California ended the season 9-1-0 and greatness once again shone on the horizon. 10 seasons of greatness graced California football during the Pappy Waldorf years. In his career, Pappy garnered a 67-32-4 overall mark, 7-1-2 against Stanford and three Rose Bowl appearances for the Golden Bears.
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Thankyou for the information. Interesting stuff and I stand corrected.
 
#104
#104
lawgator1 said:
1. It was the late 60's. I propose I be banned from the board for a week for saying it was the 70's.

2. Sixty years? How does that compare to the likes of Alabama? Tennessee? Georgia? Harvard? Notre Dame? Lehigh? Lafayette?

3. Mike Garrett won the Heisman in 1965. Charles White won it in 1979. Cunningham played in the 1970s. Ron Yary, 1960s. Pat Haden, mid-1970s. Anthony Munoz won the Hesiman in 1979. Junior played in the late 1980's.

The folks you are naming were either huge college players or big NFL stars of their time, but all are in more like the last 40 years. Not saying that USC does not have a ton of success since the mid-60s on, but I'm not at all clear on what they were doing in 1920.

Enjoyed your comment about me speaking out of my anus. That was really funny.
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As much as I hate usc I suggest you look at the decade rankings by winning percentage and major bowls on the college football database website. You wont find many decades where SC isn't near the top.
 
#117
#117
GAVol said:
Puhleeeze - Do I need to start posting links to stories about USC, Washington . . . even Cal was sanctioned a few years ago. It goes on everywhere.
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I said not like it does in other parts of the country. I'm sure every successful program has broken some sort of recruiting rule. But did UDub in the 90's, or USC now... Did they pay what Bama payed that one DL recruit? Did they give the kind of benefits FSU got caught giving their players? In Carroll's case, either he hasn't done anything worse than an illegitimate lunch (sounds like bad Chinese food) or a phone call from an ex-Trojan. Either Carroll hasn't cheated bigtime, or he hasn't gotten caught, which makes him better than Bama either way.

droski said:
the entire state of arizona produces fewer div 1a athletes than the area immediately surrounding the Cal campus. The majority of their roster is not from arizona. I like tempe because I like 100 degree dry heat, but it's definetly not for everyone. The traditional powers in the pac 10 are USC, UCLA, and Washington in that order and it isn't a coincidence. It's a lot easier to recruit when you have kids that grow up loving your program, rather than trying to poach kids from different regoins. Cal until recently didn't care about football, but if the new facilities get built is in a much better situation than ASU.

edit: another thing many people don't realize is that ASU has had some recruiting issues and the administration is REALLY cracking down on questionable admits for the athletic program. and anyone who knows about erikson knows that his best players have many times been players other teams wouldn't touch. My ASU friends tell me he's going to have run a very clean program.
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You don't need lots of talent around your immediate area to be successful. It does help some teams, though. It's a big part of how USC is doing right now, and Texas, Texas A&M, Florida, Miami, FSU... Heck, it even allows UCLA to be decent most years when the athletics dept. there focuses on water polo nat'l championships as much as football ones.

But you don't need top-end in-state talent to succeed. Take this very team right here. Tennessee doesn't produce much more in-state talent than Arizona or Washington, but the Vols still get top-end recruits year in and year out. Same goes for programs like Oklahoma, Nebraska, Boston College, etc.

lawgator1 said:
If tradition were the measure of success, then the PAC-10 would be considered an infant. Save USC, teams like Washington State or Arizona or even UCLA would be dwarfed by the lore and pageantry of the likes of Vanderbilt and Dartmouth. And but for OJ Simpson in the 70's, even USC would be dismissed as faux.

As tradition goes, it seems to me that the current top-notch conference with significant historial ties has got to be the SEC, standing way above everyonbe else. Heck, even Florida, a team constantly mocked on this site for its lack of history, has Mr. Two Bits, a guy who led a particular cheer at Gainesville for all but two home games going back 59 years.

If Tradition is the measure of success, there is simply no debate.
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The Phillies have long-running traditions and a hardcore fanbase...
 
#118
#118
milohimself said:
You don't need lots of talent around your immediate area to be successful. It does help some teams, though. It's a big part of how USC is doing right now, and Texas, Texas A&M, Florida, Miami, FSU... Heck, it even allows UCLA to be decent most years when the athletics dept. there focuses on water polo nat'l championships as much as football ones.

But you don't need top-end in-state talent to succeed. Take this very team right here. Tennessee doesn't produce much more in-state talent than Arizona or Washington, but the Vols still get top-end recruits year in and year out. Same goes for programs like Oklahoma, Nebraska, Boston College, etc.


The Phillies have long-running traditions and a hardcore fanbase...
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It makes it a lot easier if you have local talent. Oklahoma and Tennesse both have huge recruiting bases nearby and great traditions. Nebraska really doesn't recruit that well. How many programs from states without huge talent bases go from mediocrity to challenging for titles? The only example i can think of is kansas state.
 
#119
#119
droski said:
It makes it a lot easier if you have local talent. Oklahoma and Tennesse both have huge recruiting bases nearby and great traditions. Nebraska really doesn't recruit that well. How many programs from states without huge talent bases go from mediocrity to challenging for titles? The only example i can think of is kansas state.
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Not sure where you are getting the notion that Tennessee has a big in state recruiting base. Half our roster comes from out of state.
 
#120
#120
Cal got sanctions and a postseason taken away because a professor on his own passed two football players in one course who didn't complete the work. I had the same prof and he regurally made exceptions for students in trouble. The coaching staff had no idea what was going on. Because we got sanctioned for the basketball program a couple of years earlier the NCAA gave us a much stricter penalty.
 
#121
#121
GAVol said:
Not sure where you are getting the notion that Tennessee has a big in state recruiting base. Half our roster comes from out of state.
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I was including surrounding states. Though obviously you guys have a lot of competition. Oklahoma has texas nearby and since A&M is down they get a lot of good talent from there. Washington benefited from SC being down during the early 90s.
 
#122
#122
Tennessee is a weird state recruiting wise because talent is limited and due to geography probably 70% of the state is closer to an out of state SEC school.
 
#123
#123
GAVol said:
Tennessee is a weird state recruiting wise because talent is limited and due to geography probably 70% of the state is closer to an out of state SEC school.
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Exactly... And a lot of the Tennessee HS talent that is good tends to come from the western part of the state, so they go to Memphis, MSU, Ole Miss and Bama as much as they go to Tennessee.
 
#124
#124
Back in my playing days ('84-'88), it was rumored UT didn't go after much in-state talent at all. Pissed a lot of people off. Played with a guy named John Hudson..was center for Auburn...played 10+ yrs in NFL...never got a sniff from UT.
 
#125
#125
That is because for the most part, in state talent in TN is very average. Of course there are some exceptions, but HS football in TN is not that great.
 
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