We are doomed...Anthem/kneeling law

#101
#101
K-town Vol Fan said:
So if you employed someone who got 2 or 3 DUIs you wouldn't fire them? If they were seen at a KKK rally they shouldn't be fired? All actions have consequences, that's not what freedom is.
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I said lawful conduct. Attending a KKK rally is lawful, however.
 
#104
#104
volgr said:
Im saying what do you mean by saying "now how stupid do you think I am"?

You dont think if you fired an employee or changed the position, after finding out they attended a BLM rally, you wouldnt be sued?
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They might try and sue but I'm smarter than that and TN is a right to work state. I can make up any reason to fire an employee, it doesn't have to be the real reason.
 
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#105
#105
volgr said:
Im saying what do you mean by saying "now how stupid do you think I am"?

You dont think if you fired an employee or changed the position, after finding out they attended a BLM rally, you wouldnt be sued?
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One can sue for anything. Winning said suit is another issue.
 
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#106
#106
volgr said:
I said lawful conduct. Attending a KKK rally is lawful, however.
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I'd fire an employee on the spot if I found out they were attending or participating in KKK activities. Sans a contract, employment is at will in most (49) states.

You're wrong.
 
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#112
#112
FLVOL_79 said:
Meh. Lots born here who couldn't be farther from that.
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Seems immigrants used to come to America to become Americans and be a part of our unique nation. . America was a place where individual freedoms were not allowed by government ,but were "endowed by our creator". The world knew of our past sins, but also saw a nation that had ideals worth embracing and ,striving to live up to those ideals.We ended slavery, we passed laws to insure that our " life , liberty and pursuit of happiness" extended to all who would embrace our unique experiment of a government "of the people ,for the people and by the people "; our republic of divided power intended to limit an all powerful federal government from becoming an all powerful tyrant. Individual liberty and freedom was a powerful magnet for people living under rulers who considered themselves the ultimate authority and rejected the notion of "one nation under God with liberty and justice for all"

“The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money.”
― Alexis de Tocqueville
"It's not an endlessly expanding list of rights — the 'right' to education, the 'right' to health care, the 'right' to food and housing. That's not freedom, that's dependency. Those aren't rights, those are the rations of slavery — hay and a barn for human cattle.” Alexis de Tocqueville.
“Democracy extends the sphere of individual freedom, socialism restricts it. Democracy attaches all possible value to each man; socialism makes each man a mere agent, a mere number. Democracy and socialism have nothing in common but one word: equality. But notice the difference: while democracy seeks equality in liberty, socialism seeks equality in restraint and servitude.”
― Alexis de Tocqueville. Alexis de Tocqueville Quotes (Author of Democracy in America)
 
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#113
#113
hog88 said:
I do understand the concept of freedom. As an employer I'm free to fire your ass if in your off time you are an embarrassment to my company.

Freedom!
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He was an employee of a state university, not a private employer. Big distinction.
 
#114
#114
K-town Vol Fan said:
Why is the anthem even played before sporting events? Why do sports and patriotism have to go hand in hand? I dont get it.
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Like I've said in other threads, let's get rid of this at sporting events and the more fervent anthem lovers who miss it can observe it before dinner with their families in their own homes. Aren't true patriots* doing that already?

*this actually would happen in my Great Grandpa's house (not before dinner but sometimes just because). He would make everybody in the house stand and they'd sing every verse. It drove him crazy that only one verse is ever sung.
 
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#117
#117
Why not just assign players to their respective sport via chromosome. You either play in the XX or XY league. problem solved.
 
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#118
#118
me_grag said:
Just seems a bit ironic that those protesting and advocating for a fundamental change to a socialist system would be tortured or punished somehow if they felt the need to protest at some point after they get what they think they want. As the old adage goes"careful what you wish for".
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They're idealists. They're useful idiots. They do not understand what they are doing. They are teenagers and young adults that have been bombarded with wokism in the media and in colleges. Of course the are going to behave in this manner.

That is where the teaching and instruction of the counter argument comes into play by those that are so allegedly offended. You would have far more success arguing your point using the Constitution than you would a flag.
 
#119
#119
VFL-82-JP said:
Dumb move by the state senators.

I don't agree with kneeling during the Anthem, but I served 26 years in uniform to help preserve the liberty of our lads or lasses to do that, if they feel it is important.

Much better than trying to force them in this heavy-handed manner, why don't we have a dialogue with our students about the true meaning of that flag, the values that it represents--not the neodeconstructionist version that paints all dead white males from George Washington on down as the Enemy, but the true values of this nation which have been there from the start in SPITE of the darker elements of our history, like slavery.

If our young folks could understand the symbol of our flag the way I and others here understand it, they'd kneel before and after, but stand during. To honor both our country and our causes.

That's the better way.
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Just do the pregame stuff with the players not present. I agree with you about why some of us served; but since I'm one of the very first baby boomers ('46), the thing about honoring the symbols of the country is more ingrained. We learned about respect for the flag and all the courtesies in school, home, and in Boy Scouts from the WW2 generation and veterans; I'm doubting that teachers even know the rules these days. I guess another course I would take would be to no longer play the National Anthem at sporting events rather than give people the chance to show their disrespect. Being a military brat and a Viet Nam era vet; I witnessed this country go from one of national pride to one that was willing to trash all our symbols and those who would still fight so they could still have the right to do so; I'd just prefer to remove their platform.
 
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#121
#121
golfballs said:
Why? They’re not allowed to cuss out referees or their own coaches if they feel like it. Where does this idea come from that they can do or say whatever they want to while on the field representing their university?
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Parents and community. If I had knelt for the Anthem, I'm pretty sure it would be the one and only time. It likely wouldn't even have required punishment other than a few words and the cold shoulder. I also grew up in a time when the music of protest was the words of Bob Dylan or a Woody Guthrie rather than what kids listen to today. A lot of what this country was is broken - some for the good, but more for the worse. As VFL-82-JP said earlier, this is something that you have to teach your children before they go their own way; and from a parent, peer pressure is one of a parent's worst nightmares.
 
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#122
#122
Rasputin_Vol said:
They're idealists. They're useful idiots. They do not understand what they are doing. They are teenagers and young adults that have been bombarded with wokism in the media and in colleges. Of course the are going to behave in this manner.

That is where the teaching and instruction of the counter argument comes into play by those that are so allegedly offended. You would have far more success arguing your point using the Constitution than you would a flag.
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So allegedly offended? Actually offended. Mostly by the idea that even after we have done the instruction, the subversive educational system does their best to push their propoganda on the students. At one time the idea that debating opposing views was the best way to come to a reasonable and acceptable compromise. Now there is just one acceptable view espoused and any dissent is classified as subversive or evil and to be done away with. Cancelled. Opposing views have no right to be expressed. See how the universities treat conservative speakers when invited by students that have been instructed in the importance of the values expressed by our Constirution. Our schools have become nothing more than indoctrination centers led by socialist revolutionaries.
 
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#123
#123
me_grag said:
So allegedly offended? Actually offended. Mostly by the idea that even after we have done the instruction, the subversive educational system does their best to push their propoganda on the students. At one time the idea that debating opposing views was the best way to come to a reasonable and acceptable compromise. Now there is just one acceptable view espoused and any dissent is classified as subversive or evil and to be done away with. Cancelled. Opposing views have no right to be expressed. See how the universities treat conservative speakers when invited by students that have been instructed in the importance of the values expressed by our Constirution. Our schools have become nothing more than indoctrination centers led by socialist revolutionaries.
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I don't disagree. But the right has done a poor job of reaching these young people because the right engages in these worthless virtue signaling exercises that rarely ever hit the mark. Plus, how are you going to out virtue signal the originators of it on the left? Stop playing their game.

Again, forget about a flag. You are not going to win any arguments or pull people to your side doing that. Your focus should be on championing the rights and explaining the importance of those rights that are spelled out in the Bill of Rights.

You guys on the right have to understand that you are losing (or have lost) the culture war. That is where the fight is. What you've done so far has not worked. try something different.
 
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#124
#124
Rasputin_Vol said:
I don't disagree. But the right has done a poor job of reaching these young people because the right engages in these worthless virtue signaling exercises that rarely ever hit the mark. Plus, how are you going to out virtue signal the originators of it on the left? Stop playing their game.

Again, forget about a flag. You are not going to win any arguments or pull people to your side doing that. Your focus should be on championing the rights and explaining the importance of those rights that are spelled out in the Bill of Rights.

You guys on the right have to understand that you are losing (or have lost) the culture war. That is where the fight is. What you've done so far has not worked. try something different.
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So what side ae you on?
 
#125
#125
AM64 said:
Just do the pregame stuff with the players not present. I agree with you about why some of us served; but since I'm one of the very first baby boomers ('46), the thing about honoring the symbols of the country is more ingrained. We learned about respect for the flag and all the courtesies in school, home, and in Boy Scouts from the WW2 generation and veterans; I'm doubting that teachers even know the rules these days. I guess another course I would take would be to no longer play the National Anthem at sporting events rather than give people the chance to show their disrespect. Being a military brat and a Viet Nam era vet; I witnessed this country go from one of national pride to one that was willing to trash all our symbols and those who would still fight so they could still have the right to do so; I'd just prefer to remove their platform.
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And it's that easy. Kneeling during the anthem is so stupid, and it pisses people off. If the players stay in the locker room until after the anthem then problem solved. No dumb dumb little protests about something they are clueless about anyways, and no more ticking other people off over it. Problem solved, game over.
 
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